The Future of Web Startups • Hacker News Board

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#91

Post by vlad » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 2:50 AM UTC

iamelgringo wrote: post #7

electric wrote: post #6

What Paul ignores is the fact that most people out of college are faced with seemingly insurmountable debt as a result of having to pay for an education - esp. in America (and to a lesser extent in Canada). This is one problem that will prevent startups from happening at such a rapid pace as he anticipates. In fact, most graduates want to find stable jobs to pay off their debt -- startups are not really on most gradu…

[quote] What Paul ignores is the fact that most people out of college are faced with seemingly insurmountable debt as a result of having to pay for an education [/quote] Yeah, but you get a 6 month grace period after school's over before repayment begins, and you usually have several financial hardship forbearances you can take to postpone repayment. Even then, you can go back to school for one semester, and reset th…

I don't know why this was modded up. That's like saying if one can't pay the $20,000 credit card balance, American Express will delay charging interest as long as the user charges up $2,000/year more. I think one would be better off just paying the interest than adding $2,000 of classes that they will have to attend.

Also, free interest or low interest as "aid" is a joke. You still have to pay the entire amount you borrowed.

I think the only time your strategy makes sense is if you can pay $1,000 to enroll in community college for one semester in order to stay on your parents' health insurance from June to December, which comes out to $140/mo, and the quotes you received for health+dental+vision were $500 a month, therefore saving approximately $2,500 per semester, or $5,000 a year. (And I believe if you're from Massachusetts, you can stay on your parents insurance as long as you're a dependent in income level even if you're not a student.)

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#92

Post by tocomment » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 3:26 AM UTC

api wrote: post #86

rms wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He did present on the topic "The Future of Web Startups" at a conference called "The Future of Web Apps." Perhaps you can forgive his limited perspective.

True enough. It just irritates me occasionally that the startup community seems overly focused on the web. There is a lot more out there that can be done than just web sites.

Examples?

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#93

Post by tedhenry » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 3:45 AM UTC

If being in silicon valley is important to mix with the best and brightest then being in a good university deserves the same argument/conclusion. Any old university won't have students capable of learning at fast pace and so the curriculum will be watered down. Any old university won't have high quality teachers that can mentor the most gifted students.

I do think taking that last exam and finishing university was a magical moment. Following a commitment through to the end even when things are tough or tedious is valuable experience. You can get this other ways but there is a huge difference between someone who stuck in there and finished university and someone who called it off just three credits short.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#94

Post by myth_drannon » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 4:03 AM UTC

gcheong wrote: post #63

Does anyone believe that the future viability of web application innovation depends on the availability of consumer access to higher and higher bandwidth connections (at a cheaper and cheaper cost - to the point of commoditization), and if so, as the US falls further behind other countries in this respect,will that reduce the relevance of Silicon Valley as a startup hub for web application companies? Which country (c…

Russia(future?) or Israel(I guess it is a leader now)

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#95

Post by grail » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 4:56 AM UTC

garbowza wrote: post #10

The proliferation of startups also exposes a need for better integration. If signing up for accounts and remembering usernames/passwords for a dozen different sites is a pain, think about doing that for hundreds!

That's what OpenID is for.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#96

Post by cuda » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 5:17 AM UTC

Startling, arresting and direct as always. Thank you.

The one thing I find interesting is the overall theme that seems to pervade many of these essays--mainly that all trends are moving to increase the importance of hackers. While this is true for now, I think the more the web evolves and the easier it becomes for non-hackers or even technologists to build apps and start companies then the advantage potentially moves strongly to those that understand consumers and markets. Which may well be hackers, but also may not depending on the app--as has been pointed out in the past by Josh Kopelman the Tech Crunch 50,000 of 2006 (or even 550,000 of 2007) is not the mass market.

Thanks again--nothing I read provokes more intense thought than your essays.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#97

Post by shawndrost » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 5:19 AM UTC

This essay argues against local YC clones, which I think is at odds with another point he's made. As he says in "Why to not not etc", the most powerful reason people get regular jobs is because they're conventional. Local YC clones can make startups vastly more conventional by supporting hackers who aren't ready to take the leap and move.

Furthermore, I'd like to point out that even if local YC clones perform worse than YC, there may still be a market for them. State governments pay much more than YC (monetary) costs to encourage YC effects. Local VCs demand more startups, and people to tell them which startups to invest in. And as I argued above, many YC-caliber hackers would be interested in a local YC knockoff, but not YC itself.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#98

Post by alex_c » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 5:44 AM UTC

allenbrunson wrote: post #39

byrneseyeview wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're very specific about what you won't do, but very vague about what you will do. Why?

erm, because it seems off-topic here? this is paul's world. i like reading about the energy and creativity involved in web startups. i personally think that narrowing the field to just web startups is short-sighted, but that's not my call to make, certainly not here.

Web apps are probably the most common because the barrier to entry is very low, but the field really seems to be more "software" rather than "only web apps". Xobni is desktop software, Loopt is mobile software, Justin.tv is (as I understand it) a mix of hardware and web streaming.

Interestingly, those also seem to be some of the higher profile projects.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#99

Post by gingerk » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 6:17 AM UTC

So much to think about. One niggling question I have is related to the definition of "start ups". I've heard and read varying opinions. Is a start up a new business with an idea to execute on the web or is a start up a company that executes an idea on the the web or is it both or neither? Depending on the definition of start up, there will be vastly different business models, challenges and economic opportunities.

Re: The Future of Web Startups

#100

Post by rms » Fri, Oct 05, 2007, 6:23 AM UTC

gingerk wrote: post #99

So much to think about. One niggling question I have is related to the definition of "start ups". I've heard and read varying opinions. Is a start up a new business with an idea to execute on the web or is a start up a company that executes an idea on the the web or is it both or neither? Depending on the definition of start up, there will be vastly different business models, challenges and economic opportunities.

The major difference between a business and a startup is that a startup is intended to scale extremely quickly.