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Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

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Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#11

Post by zimbabwe »

evilneanderthal wrote: post #10
zimbabwe wrote: post #2

I guess I'm the first person to say that yes, I did cheat, and no, I don't feel guilty. What matters is getting the right answer. If you stop before you get the right answer, then you're responsible for that. If you take a shortcut to get the right answer, then it's not a bad thing until you get to a situation where you refuse to do what it takes to get the right answer. Given a choice between wasting my time on mean…

Someone might argue that part of schoolwork is proving that you can do boring routine work. In this respect you only have the long-term incentive of graduating and there is no immediate reward.

So far I have never found an instance in life where doing boring routine work was at all something I wanted to do. The boring routine work I do have to do I constantly try and figure out ways around.

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#13

Post by ryanwaggoner »

zimbabwe wrote: post #2

I guess I'm the first person to say that yes, I did cheat, and no, I don't feel guilty. What matters is getting the right answer. If you stop before you get the right answer, then you're responsible for that. If you take a shortcut to get the right answer, then it's not a bad thing until you get to a situation where you refuse to do what it takes to get the right answer. Given a choice between wasting my time on mean…

Why bother going to school if this is how you view it?

I think the problem with cheating is that it's fundamentally dishonest. It's not that you're using someone else's work to accomplish something, as we all do this every day in our jobs, it's that you're lying and presenting that work as your own.

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#15

Post by ryanwaggoner »

I'm a little appalled by the number of people who apparently think cheating is fine. Is integrity so uncommon?

As I stated another comment, the problem I have with cheating is that it's dishonest, as you're passing someone else's work off as your own. It demonstrates a lack of respect for the person who did the work, the person you're doing the work for, every student who worked hard enough to do the work themselves, and yourself.

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#16

Post by deno »

I did try to cheat. However, it's much more common thing in Poland than USA (or so I heard).

I noticed however, that whenever I've selected material for cheating and then put it on those little sheets of paper I actually learned this material in the end. So cheating was a great way to learn something! Than, by simple logic taking what I prepared wasn't beneficial, as I could be caught.

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#17

Post by ryanwaggoner »

zimbabwe wrote: post #11
evilneanderthal wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone might argue that part of schoolwork is proving that you can do boring routine work. In this respect you only have the long-term incentive of graduating and there is no immediate reward.

So far I have never found an instance in life where doing boring routine work was at all something I wanted to do. The boring routine work I do have to do I constantly try and figure out ways around.

Apparently even when those ways around it require you to lie and steal the work of others. What won't you do to avoid boring routine work?

And isn't this the very definition of laziness? Being willing to cross ethical boundaries to avoid unpleasant work?

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#18

Post by ryanwaggoner »

zimbabwe wrote: post #8
hollerith wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"What matters is getting the right answer." Oh, so it was your principled commitment to "what matters" that caused you to cheat, eh?

That's a bullshit way of phrasing it. Let's stick to how I said it. What matters is that you end up with the right thing. If you can easily get the right thing by copying somebody else, then do that. That doesn't excuse your not learning how to do it on your own, but there's no nobility to finding out the answer yourself, beyond what personal satisfaction it brings you. I code using other people's languages and other…

There's no honor in taking someone else's hard work and passing it off as your own.

Looking at someone else's website for visual inspiration is a far cry from copying someone else's paper or having a friend do your math homework. Please tell me you see the difference.

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#19

Post by Confusion »

ryanwaggoner wrote: post #15

I'm a little appalled by the number of people who apparently think cheating is fine. Is integrity so uncommon? As I stated another comment, the problem I have with cheating is that it's dishonest, as you're passing someone else's work off as your own. It demonstrates a lack of respect for the person who did the work, the person you're doing the work for, every student who worked hard enough to do the work themselves,…

Define 'cheating'. I've never cheated, but I voted 'it depends', because, as always, everything depends on intentions and circumstances. I can perfectly understand people saying 'this assignment/test is ridiculous. I'm not going to put any effort in it and rather copy/cheat and spend my time in a more productive way'.

Now I don't think you should copy from someone if that person objects. However, I've never worried about allowing people to copy my work: I've already invested the time and as long as it doesn't put my work in jeopardy (that was always my only requirement: don't just copy, but expend the minimal effort required to hide it), why not share? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of what is worth their time. As has been argued many times, especially at forums like HN: schools really don't know what is good for their students. Schools are 'one size fits all'. We know better (which doesn't mean that we think schools are always wrong, which doesn't mean we don't take their advice seriously, etc.)

Re: Poll: Were/Are you a cheater?

#20

Post by michaelneale »

Never cheated at school or university - would like to say cause I thought it was right but mostly cause the consequences of being caught multiplied by the likelyhood of being caught was greater then my risk appetite (well perhaps I did think it was just wrong at some base level as well).

I do get lazy with tests sometimes, and it does come back to bite me in the ass. Often.

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