Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

naildrivin5.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 81 posts

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#71

Post by kps »

asdasf wrote: post #56
eliasmacpherson wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think USB precludes NKRO, see this: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=17458.0

It does. USB can't report enough keys being pressed at the same time. So keyboards that support n-key rollover internally can only support 6 key when using USB: http://www.daskeyboard.com/product/model-s-ultimate/

The standard keyboard HID descriptor has room for only 6 keys (plus the 8 modifiers). In principle the keyboard can just define a larger descriptor, but not all hosts allow this. Some 'NKRO' keyboards pretend to be a hub with multiple keyboards attached, but at least some of these don't handle modifiers properly for hosts that don't merge all keyboard input into one.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#72

Post by xntrk »

mike_h wrote: post #32
jfb wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there should be a 100% remappable keyboard. I never use any of the legacy key functions, but the switches are precious on a fixed piece of hardware. It is maddening to me that there are dead keys on my keyboards; having a completely soft layout would allow me to customize things exactly the way I want.

The Kinesis Advantage line is fully remappable, including macros. It's also premium hardware (nice switches) and a supremely ergo layout, with most keys within reach of the home row, and the thumb region divided up into multiple frequently-used (remappable) keys: http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/advantage.htm Don't be cowed by the esoteric appearance; it's really just a tweak on the standard layout.

Kinesis is so worth the money. I have been using mine for about 4-5 years. swapped my esc and capslock ages ago.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#73

Post by kps »

bricker wrote: post #69
bhauer wrote: post #8

I agree with what I take as the underlying premise of this blog entry: if you're going to call something a "keyboard for programmers" it would be nice if you made concerted effort to improve matters for programmers, moreso than just tactile ergonomics. However, I have mixed feelings with several of the author's specific points. 1. In general, I think a keyboard should retain all legacy keys, including Scroll Lock and…

> It bothers me that / and \ are not side-by-side on most/all keyboards I agree with you regarding the brackets - , ( ), etc. ... but / and \ have nothing to do with each other.

Point of order! \ was invented specifically to pair with /, to write the ∧ and ∨ operators as /\ and \/.

[1] http://www.bobbemer.com/BACSLASH.HTM

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#74

Post by danneu »

xahrepap wrote: post #61
jerf wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Very much agree that Caps Lock should be diminished in importance.... Many of my colleagues and I simply disable the key outright." Augh! Don't do that! Remap it to something useful! CTRL is popular, but I'm loving backspace, personally. It's a key that never comes up if you just count keys based on taking text file samples, but I for one like having it available where it does not rip my fingers off the home row. (S…

[ESC] is my personal preference. I will never look back, and I never have once needed the capslock key since I switched it out.

Best of both worlds: CTRL when used as modifier, ESC when pressed alone.

- On OSX: https://pqrs.org/macosx/keyremap4macbook/

- On Linux: https://github.com/alols/xcape

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#75

Post by danneu »

vizzah wrote: post #65

"Stupid keys" PgUp/PgDn??! I wonder how people navigate and read through their source code if not using PageUp/Down. Scrolling with mouse? When one key press can bring you exactly one page forward or backwards. Irreplacable keys for me. I can't code properly on a keyboard which doesn't have these keys under my third and middle finger (making short jumps from the set of 4 arrow keys).

Ctrl-D/U in Vim.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#76

Post by sluu99 »

most i agree, except "Stupid keys like Page Up, Scroll Lock, and Insert are gone. They have no place in modern computing."

Having the default 2 x 3 insert home pgup; delete end pgdown is my #1 requirement to any keyboard.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#77

Post by tzs »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #41
bhauer wrote: post #8

I agree with what I take as the underlying premise of this blog entry: if you're going to call something a "keyboard for programmers" it would be nice if you made concerted effort to improve matters for programmers, moreso than just tactile ergonomics. However, I have mixed feelings with several of the author's specific points. 1. In general, I think a keyboard should retain all legacy keys, including Scroll Lock and…

We're all brown moties [1] Keyboards are fundamentally a personal preference, and perhaps like instruments are a function of both the 'action' (key movement) and the layout. I abhor the location of capslock/control because when I was first learning to program I only used terminals where control was the key where caps lock is. When I was forced to used keyboards that had control down at the lower left I went from usin…

Niven & Pournelle.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#78

Post by Marwy »

numo16 wrote: post #63
jerf wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I think there should be a 100% remappable keyboard." You have one. It's the one you typed that post on. A keyboard just emits numbers, it's up to the computer OS to determine what to do with it. Exactly how to customize your keyboard is OS-specific, but it can be done in all the major ones, as far as I know. (Can't commit to Windows 8. Windows 7 did require some unpleasant registry hacking for changing caps lock.) I…

On windows I use Autohotkey [1] to remap keys (capslock to backspace, qwerty to colemak, etc...), no registry hacks required. You just have to remember to run the script on startup. [1]: http://www.autohotkey.com/

Some time ago I used it to quickly change my layout from qwerty to colemak, and often it couldn't keep up with my speed (and I'm an average typist: ca. 65 WPM), which resulted in wrong order of characters. I tried both interpreted and compiled version - no difference. It wasn't a beefy machine, though, so with your i5s and 8 gigs it may work well ;-).

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#79

Post by seferphier »

Filligree wrote: post #51
seferphier wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is just a normal mechanical keyboard. any one who never tried a mechanical keyboard would love it.

As opposed to..? Are you implying that someone who has wouldn't like it?

na. i personally haven't tried the build quality of WASD, but I heard it is really solid.

should be a pretty good keyboard for 150. there are others out there for the same price if it is sold out.

Re: A Real Keyboard for Programmers?

#80

Post by Filligree »

seferphier wrote: post #79
Filligree wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to..? Are you implying that someone who has wouldn't like it?

na. i personally haven't tried the build quality of WASD, but I heard it is really solid. should be a pretty good keyboard for 150. there are others out there for the same price if it is sold out.

It is. :P

There are a couple others mentioned in the discussion, but which would you suggest?

Post reply on HN