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He got 1%, we can't hire him

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Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#71

Post by dmar »

Aqua_Geek wrote: post #4

Where do you work that psychometric tests are required of candidates? It's the first I've heard of something like this (outside of various gov't/military jobs).

My current company do this, we've around 600 employees across Europe and every candidate for an IT position in the UK takes the same test at a 1st/2nd level interview.

Unlike the OP it's at the hirer's discretion how much weight they put in the score and it's made clear to us there's a definite pattern that more nervous candidates & those without English as a natural language score less well. We ask them to come into the office, only in rare occasions does someone do it remotely.

Most of my candidates in software positions score 40-70% and have done well in the company, I've had a number in the 0-20% bracket of whom I took 1 based on his good performance in other aspects of the interview - he's not turned out to be a great hire relative to the others. A handful in the company get the 95%+ scores and they've all done well - I think many are among the best performers in our department suggesting some kind of particular capability.

The output of the test is a % score with breakdown in a few catagories plus a 2-3 page personality profile. I showed mine to a few ex colleagues, it said probably 8 things like "will have days where he's uncommunicative or seems unfriendly and days he's warmer" which everyone pointed out as eerily true about me (and the negative aspects I can therefore work on!) but it read a little like a horoscope in that you can probably find truth in it and it's up to you to what extent you forgive the paragraphs that are very untrue, although presented in a scientific way.

Honestly, I think it's pretty helpful as accompanying information and would use it again at another job

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#72

Post by hrvbr »

antirez wrote: post #14

Improving a company 101: * Get rid of HR people. * Profit.

Well, developers can hire other developers, but we can't easily hire the accountants, lawyers and others (including HR, ironically). The big question is: how do we hire people from a field we're not competent in?

But yes, at my last job interview, I succeeded at the technical interview but failed at the 'personality' one. It's a loss for them, not for me.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#73

Post by Xylakant »

antirez wrote: post #14

Improving a company 101: * Get rid of HR people. * Profit.

I respectfully disagree. Get some decent HR people and don't give them the last call on hiring decisions. Make it clear that HR is supporting the process, but not leading the process and that the last call is with the department/team that is looking for a hire. Let HR take all the tedious tasks of hiring from the developers, such as all the legalese, handling employee benefits, sick reports and all associated paperwork, but do not let them define the flow of a hiring process. Developer time is far to valuable to be wasted on mainly administrative side-tasks.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#74

Post by Supermighty »

mgkimsal wrote: post #64

"The psychometric test was supposed to produce a "true" reflection of how someone saw themselves, and I was told it couldn't change over time - i.e. whatever it determined was fixed, immutable and infallable." 20 years ago I took the Meyers-Briggs test multiple times (well, once a year for 3 years). My numbers changed a little bit each time - I was fairly strong I and N, but very weak 'T' and 'J', to the point where…

I've taken the Meyers-Briggs several times and tried to answer in a way to get different outcomes. I've answered realistically, speculatively, and hopefully. Each time I got the same result.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#75

Post by kunil »

penguat wrote: post #5
Aqua_Geek wrote: post #4

Where do you work that psychometric tests are required of candidates? It's the first I've heard of something like this (outside of various gov't/military jobs).

Here in the UK, it's not uncommon in large companies.

HR must do something to got paid, let's do a stupid test to each candidate!

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#76

Post by ehamberg »

flexd wrote: post #29
rdl wrote: post #6

I don't get it -- was this at an operating company hiring people, or at the author's recruiting company (which seems to be a depressingly common way to hire people in Europe)? If a recruiting company is so incompetent as to require personality profiling, and worse, enforce it so rigidly, it would explain why Europe lags so far behind the US in tech startups, despite having at least as many (if not substantially more)…

I was interested in applying for a job here in Norway, but it turned out the company had 2-3+ interviews (which would mean spending the day at their offices) over several months, as well as some sort of IQ test and other things. That was in the spring and they expected to have picked out some people by the end of summer. I didn't apply, mostly because I am happy where I am, but also because a 3-5 month interview proc…

> Is this a common practice?

I've gone through two interview processes in Norway – none of them took longer than ten days and I can't say I have heard about anyone else that has been through months-long processes either. (I'm a software engineer.)

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#77

Post by mattbillenstein »

The main problem is companies are too afraid of firing people - a "good fit" from an HR perspective is someone they won't have to fire later.

They are "risk averse" insofar as they would rather hire a safe and comfortable person who meets their personality metrics rather than take a chance on someone outside of that who is technically sharper.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#78

Post by willvarfar »

Aqua_Geek wrote: post #4

Where do you work that psychometric tests are required of candidates? It's the first I've heard of something like this (outside of various gov't/military jobs).

I recall hearing - I think it was an article posted to HN a few months back - that handwriting assessments are common in France.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#79

Post by Shivetya »

too many in authority want the glory of title, they do not want to be responsible, hence they tend not to do. Hence, when they run across people who can think, can do, get it done, they create systems where adherence is more important that work.

Those on the other end fail these wonderful HR tests because they all too often have to around the title hounds to keep the business they work in up and running.

Re: He got 1%, we can't hire him

#80

Post by seanmcdirmid »

illumen wrote: post #61
nakedrobot2 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the lack of invetors and VCs in Europe - it is the lack of ability to invest in RISKY companies - the very definition of "startup". European investors are just bankers (with a few exceptions).

lol. London does quite a lot of risky financial shit. Also you might have heard of a little company kicking the shit out of Intel... ARM. Based in Cambridge UK, that is also where most tech investments in Europe are happening (not London or Berlin). Also, Germany and Switzerland are much more quiet and private about investments. You won't hear about many of them. These days you can invest in a UK startup, and have th…

Don't developers in London get paid crap though? I've heard horror stories about ridiculously low London salaries here on Hackernews. Are the low salaries just because their is a surplus developer talent in the UK?
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