Live data from Hacker News

Map of America's Racial Segregation

wired.com

81–90 of 192 posts

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#81
post #79
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The overriding trend in American cities is that whites will not live in predominantly black or hispanic neighborhoods.[1] But the reverse is generally not true. So you see much less segregation in predominantly white cities like Portland than in cities like Chicago that have an even mix of races, which have less segregation than predominantly black cities like Detroit or New Orleans. As far as I can tell, most Europe…

As far as I can tell, most European cities are predominantly white This is both true, and yet misleading and hence false. Yes, by US racial/ethnic definitions the majority of european cities are majority 'white'. But we don't use the US categories (of white/black/latino/etc.) here in EU because it's not accurate. In fact EU law claims "The European Union rejects theories which attempt to determine the existence of se…

That's certainly a fair point, but would you say that there are axes of diversity in European cities that have properties similar to racial delineations in the U.S.? That is to say, political tensions arising from economic disparity as well as strong cohesion within distinct social groups?

I don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of European social conflict, but I don't imagine there is a lot of catholic versus protestant tension in say London, nor do I imagine there are persistent and massive socioeconomic disparities between the two groups in London (or at least nothing comparable to the more than factor of 2x disparity between blacks and whites I cited for Chicago).

And running with your example, what do you imagine would have been the political situation in the U.K. if say London had consisted of 60-70% Irish nationalist Catholics in 1985?

Or is there still discrimination within categories of whites? Are Londoners whose families originally hail from say Poland still dramatically disadvantaged compared to ones who can trace their origins in England for centuries? And if so, what would the politics be in the U.K. if London consisted of 60-70% of these hypothetical disadvantaged poles?

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#82
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can go too far from reality with political correctness but you can go just as far in the other direction with the "lack" of political correctness. The US has a much higher tolerance for what in Europe would be considered pretty blatant racism. I think that Political Correctness for the most part says we should treat everyone equally whether we like them or not which is the rational approach as I'm sure there are…

Perhaps you and I have a different idea on what "Political Correctness" actually is. My view is that many mistake Scientifically Correct from Politically Correct. It is Scientifically Correct to say that there is very little difference, genetically, between Europeans, Asians, Africans, Latin Americans, etc. It also happens to be Politically Correct. However, it is also Scientifically Correct to say that there are hug…

Citing violent crime statistics as proof of a "cultural problem" without any regressors is not particularly helpful. What are the relevant demography-adjusted statistics? There are certainly some (edit: sub-)cultural aspects, but every culture has some aspects of the negative traits you cite (e.g. most people tend to disdain out-group achievement). These traits are often drastically accentuated by poverty. In the case of black Americans, doubly so by the compounding effects of high urbanization levels.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#83
post #78

This is a really cool map! I have a few questions about it though. Racial Segregation are very strong words to use when describing this map. I have lived in Chicago for my whole life. I have heard people say that Chicago is the most segregated city in the US. That line might be true. But when I look at this map it is very hard to draw the assumption that Chicago is incredibly segregated. Looking at this map you could…

When people talk about segregation in Chicago, they are mostly referring to the black south and near west side, and to a lesser extent the hispanic near-southwest and Little Village areas.

Look closely at the map on this thread, and match it up to a Chicago neighborhood map. Look at the border between Beverly (where I grew up) and Gresham and Brainerd. Look at the borders around Hyde Park. Look at the border between Austin and Oak Park (where I live now). For that matter, look at Lawndale vs Little Village. The borders are sharp, they follow regular lines, and generally involve a 90+% majority black neighborhood on one side.

There are a bunch of reasons this happened:

* The Great Migration, during which Chicago was a giant magnet for rural black southerners

* Redlining, the overtly racist/segregationist practice of refusing home loans to black families in "non-black" neighborhoods

* The construction of the Ryan, which displaced black families who ended up moving to places like Englewood

* The construction of the CHA high rise housing projects, which were concentrated in areas that would eventually become majority-black

* The subsequent flight of white families from places like Englewood, which went from 10% black immediately after WW2 to 98+%(!) black in 1980

It's important to note that with the possible exception of Beverly, which really is a white Irish enclave, the non-black non-hispanic neighborhoods in Chicago aren't intolerant, and have black representation roughly in line with their representation in the population as a whole. If you live in Avondale or Rogers Park or Lakeview, it probably doesn't look at all segregated.

Also, Chicago isn't the most segregated city in the US.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#84
post #21

Thomas Schelling [0] has shown that even if your most preferred neighborhood is a perfect mix of races, it is a dynamically unstable equilibrium (assuming that if the balance tips one way or the other, you prefer it to tip towards your own race). That is, segregated neighborhoods are not necessarily a sign that people prefer segregation -- it is also a natural outcome when people want to live in a mixed neighborhood.…

Do people pick their dwelling by racial mix? I would expect this to be much more of a function of income and means.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#85
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this kind of statistic is that it doesn't really teach us much: "Hey, impoverished communities have a higher rate of criminality! Who would have thought!" while at the same time giving arguments for the far right to simplify the issues and reach simple conclusions. Maybe there are cases where these statistics could be legitimately useful, but I'm not aware of any.

Impoverished communities are a problem here. For some reason whether you have a community of muslims or africans, it happens to be impoverished. On the other hand, if you have a community of asians or western europeans, it doesn't. That's exactly the problem parent is trying to convey. It's not that africans are inherently criminal, it's just that they have dangerous group dynamics.

> On the other hand, if you have a community of asians or western europeans, it doesn't.

I might be mis-understanding the context here: I've been to a few impoverished communities composed of 98% descendants of Western Europeans. Think: white trash.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, it could be that the police are overly vigilant, or even racist against non-white Swedes, and arrest and incarcerate them at a rate disproportionate to the actual rate of crime. Stop and Frisk in NYC overwhelmingly targets blacks and latinos, to the point where it's been declared unconstitutional, for example.

Crime victim surveys corroborate those figures.

Just to be clear, corroborate which figures?

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#87
post #25

Is segregation really the appropriate word here? Separation of the races is coded into our genes and happens naturally without any malicious intent too. It's not much different from the fact that all of us prefer to surround ourselves with people who are similar to ourselves, usually in terms of thinking, hobbies, and interests. Physical attributes influence us as well, whether it's bikers and leather jackets or punk…

"Separation of the races is coded into our genes" What? How so?

"Physical attributes influence us as well" But which physical attributes matter and which don't is cultural. I'm tall. I don't only or even mostly hang around other tall people. I'm left handed. I don't hang out with left handed people.

"but has also extremely skewed gender distributions in professions such as engineering and nursing; with almost only men in engineering, and women in nursing, despite massive attempts to balance the situation. This could be easily misinterpreted and claimed as evidence that Norway does not respect gender equality, but in fact it's more likely evidence of the opposite! People in Norway are more free to pursue what makes them happy."

Or gender stereotypes which predated attempts at gender equality still persist and encourage people to think that certain jobs will make them happier than others even though this may not be true.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#88
If there was not hatred (not gonna happen, by the way), would segregation still be a bad thing?

Is there something inherently WRONG with people gravitating toward and feeling most comfortable around people who look like themselves?

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#89
Interesting project but it seems only useful at all for large cities. I zoomed in on the rural area I live in and there wasn't anything. They mention toggling between color and black and white but there still wasn't anything there.

Re: Map of America's Racial Segregation

#90
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* This is elementary statistics based on data collected by the FBI. If this problem [..] can't be discussed in an honest fashion due to political organizations which will threaten politicians with boycotts/villification/etc due to their refusal to acknowledge inconvenient truths, then the problem will simply continue.* These statistics are discussed in an honest fashion, from Saturday mornings in the barber shop to a…

"This sentence would be equally true without the word "black." Political correctness indeed." Sorry, but the phenomenon of being accused of betraying your cultural identity by peers if you succeed in school and get a job is mainly a phenomenon found in a sub-culture of black America. Anyone who has been immersed in an African-American community for any length of time can tell you this. The typical insult among school…

Another minority that is fucked over in this regard is Native Americans. You can ask anyone who grew up on a reservation - there's very little support for academics because it's seen as betraying your culture and colluding with the white man at the expense of their own culture. As a result, Native Americans, especially those who grow up on reservations, suffer from disproportionate rates of poverty.
Post reply on HN