Beware of geeks bearing gifts • Hacker News Board

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#11

Post by pjmlp » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 11:34 AM UTC

kintamanimatt wrote: post #10

tlarkworthy wrote: post #3

Yeah Microsoft gives windows to schools. Generous bastards.

They do that so students grow up knowing one operating system: Windows. Such students grow up, graduate, and then feel more comfortable using it in the workplace (and at home); it ends up being a net positive for Microsoft. If schools didn't receive free Windows licenses, such schools might end up using Ubuntu! Imagine how that would affect Microsoft's future profits and product adoption if the next generation of wor…

No different than the program Apple had for American schools, if I am not mistaken.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#12

Post by inthewind » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 11:37 AM UTC

alexfarran wrote: post #9

Help! My digital self has been enslaved by corporate missionaries and forced to drink coke. Can we calm down on the emotive metaphors a little so I can see the actual point?

The take home I got was to question Facebook and Google's motives.

Loon and Android (or a free alternative) could make for a pretty sweet peer to peer alternative Internet.

Perhaps an alternative would be to bounce signals off of other satellites.

http://www.edn.com/electronics-blogs/edn-moments/4404759/Pro...

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#13

Post by TeMPOraL » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 11:48 AM UTC

I'd argue that Google-sponsored Internet is better than no Internet. Also I don't see any "digital enslavement" plans embedded in Google or Facebook initiative. Just giving those people Internet will be enough to benefit Google and Facebook hugely, as probably significant percent of newly connected will start using their services. They don't need to capture every single person, therefore they don't need to conspire to "enslave" anyone.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#14

Post by pearkes » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 11:50 AM UTC

> What Facebook and Google have done is discovered a village with no water and they plan to bring them cheap Coke to buy when—if their motives were truly honorable—there is another glaringly obvious option: you could teach them to build a well.

Funny you should mention Coke. It turns out that these businesses desiring profits can pretty efficiently solve or make improvement to problems, like distribution, in places like Africa.[1]

Regardless of their motivation, either with balloons or wires, the deep pockets and ingenuity of Google and Facebook will connect people who aren't. And, they'll do it faster and more efficiently then government, charity.

Their "evil" desire for profits will benefit us, as Coke has, apparently.[2]

[1] http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/25/coke-applie... (2012)

[2] It's obviously not all roses, with the health concerns, etc. Point is that they solved a problem motivated by profit, and now health organizations, etc. are able to learn from that, directly or just by watching. They're moving us in generally the right direction.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#15

Post by gz5 » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:04 PM UTC

Even if a "neutral ISP" was providing the access, they could always partner with a Google or Facebook to produce the same result.

Arguably some Internet is better than no Internet but I don't think there is a complete solution until there is enough competition at the local access that a user can choose between a completely open pipe and Google like alternatives?

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#16

Post by VMG » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:05 PM UTC

Life is not zero-sum. Just because big corporations gain, doesn't mean you have to lose.

And please, stop with the slavery metaphor. It's offensive. There are actual slaves in Africa that would love the serfdom of targeted ads.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#17

Post by achalkley » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:09 PM UTC

VMG wrote: post #16

Life is not zero-sum. Just because big corporations gain, doesn't mean you have to lose. And please, stop with the slavery metaphor. It's offensive. There are actual slaves in Africa that would love the serfdom of targeted ads.

When the internet is being used as a "right" or commodity like food and your digital persona, which you don't "own", is being used to profit someone else, and your "right" to it is revoked if you choose to "own" it, the metaphor is apt.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#18

Post by StavrosK » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:10 PM UTC

Sorry, do we know that you'll only be able to get online if you only have a Google account? I haven't heard anything like that, and if, as I suspect, nothing hints that this will happen, then this is much gnashing of teeth about nothing.

If Google does require a Google account to get online, then, okay, it's not as selfless as before, but it's still internet access where people had none before. The possibility of accessing Wikipedia and Khan Academy is worth an inactive Google account, at least.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#19

Post by GFischer » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:10 PM UTC

annnnd wrote: post #6

axelfreeman wrote: post #4

I am pretty sure my internet service provider is already doing that. I don't see the difference. Did i miss something? They didn't say it's free.

What, your ISP already mines data about you and sells it? If I knew that about mine I would leave it ASAP.

Good luck if it's a state monopoly (mine is). Between bad internet and no internet, I chose bad internet.

Re: Beware of geeks bearing gifts

#20

Post by Tichy » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 12:10 PM UTC

Providing internet access is not the same as locking somebody into their cloud services.

There is such a thing as win win in business. Yes, Google benefits if more people are on the internet, because of the network effect - more people searching, more stuff to be found, and, yes, more potential advertising space. It's useful even without lock in.