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Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

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Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#41

Post by PommeDeTerre »

nknighthb wrote: post #25
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #21

Regardless of whether it's right or wrong, physical appearance can often have a big impact when dealing with certain clientele. Certain types of clients just prefer to deal with people who conform to what might be considered a more "conservative" appearance. Deviating from their expectations can reduce their level of trust, for instance, which can impact business dealings. This is especially true when dealing with cu…

> Some people have also had very, very bad experiences with other people who dress or groom themselves in a specific way. I've had very, very bad experiences with people who dress in suits. Indeed, the people who have had the most severe negative effects on my life have invariably worn suits. And I can't name many people I've had positive experiences with who ever wear suits. Yet, somehow, I don't think that's what y…

I take it that you're not a "person who wears a suit"?

The reality of the business world is that those who control the money are often "people who wear suits". This is especially true when large sums of money are involved.

If a given business wants such people (and the organizations they represent) as clients, then the business will need to conform to the expectations of these potential clients. The impact of such conformance can be even greater on a startup, which may not have much leeway or influence in such dealings.

I'm not "defending" nor "promoting" what happened in this case; the details are much too vague. I'm merely pointing out that there are factors at play in the real world which may make such decisions more plausible and more comprehensible.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#42

Post by brianmcconnell »

epoxyhockey wrote: post #33

One of the more frustrating things about working in the Bay Area is having to deal with finicky personalities like the OP's boss & CEO. It really takes a psychopath to court a potential hire so hard and then fire them 5 weeks later due to their appearance (after they sign a couple of large customers, btw). If this were NYC, I could understand stabbing someone in the back after they secure a couple of large customers.…

I watched a CEO fire someone he had recruited cross country just weeks after he had relocated his family to the Bay Area. They screwed him and his family over real good. Not long afterward, the CEO fired his outside accountant and made his wife the CFO of the company. I straight up asked if he was hiding something, knowing that he probably was and that my stock and bonus were fictional.

I was fired immediately afterward. I laughed gleefully on the drive home from the comically bad exit interview.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#43

Post by liquidise »

cjensen wrote: post #26

His boss fired him and told him why? Never do that. When firing someone in an at-will state, just do it and explain nothing. Explanations can easily lead to lawsuits. It's just not worth the risk.

At the fear of being labeled immature/unprofessional: i have found that in many cases i morally owe my employees reasons for their being let go. I have never had to release an engineer on behavioral issues, so i always try to be clear with them about paths to improvement.

i'm certain this varies across companies, but in the startups i have worked for i've build very close relationships to many of my coworkers. i like to think there is a mutual trust established in that relationship. Part of that trust includes me looking out for their best interests, which i feel includes explaining to them what their next steps are to further their careers after they depart.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#44

Post by mratzloff »

ececconi wrote: post #29

> Human Resources is not your advocate. Human Resources is a risk-assessment department. Powerful statement.

> Powerful statement.

It's a bit naive to believe that HR is about anything other than protecting the company.

Sure, employees have the side benefit of having someone to go to to answer questions about pay schedule, holidays, and benefits, but that's all it is: a side benefit. The real reason is to limit the company's legal exposure.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#46

Post by peterjancelis »

mathattack wrote: post #6

Very tough story. What I don't get is why someone who is so good at sales (the story supports this) is on food stamps. If you can say, "I landed clients A, B and C" then a competitor would hire you to do it for them too, no?

The counter-party risk for a sales guy is in seeing those commission checks coming in after you deliver the goods.

Looks like his trust was violated and the new discounted expectations make him not apply for equivalent jobs anymore.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#47

Post by soneca »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #24
brianmcconnell wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can imagine 99% of customers never putting two and two together in the first place. I talk to salespeople all the time, and not once have I thought to inquire about their personal interests, side projects, etc.

That may be true for you and the other 99% of customers. However, if that 1% of customers who do consider such things to matter are the most important of a given firm's customers, then their opinions on such issues can have an astronomical impact on the business.

An advise like "please put a hold on your side project or at least creat a different name to deal with that" would have solved the problem. Or at least would be transparent.

Sure, we only listened to one side, but this sounds like creating absurd reasoning to try to justify what the company did.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#48

Post by nknighthb »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #41
nknighthb wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people have also had very, very bad experiences with other people who dress or groom themselves in a specific way. I've had very, very bad experiences with people who dress in suits. Indeed, the people who have had the most severe negative effects on my life have invariably worn suits. And I can't name many people I've had positive experiences with who ever wear suits. Yet, somehow, I don't think that's what y…

I take it that you're not a "person who wears a suit"? The reality of the business world is that those who control the money are often "people who wear suits". This is especially true when large sums of money are involved. If a given business wants such people (and the organizations they represent) as clients, then the business will need to conform to the expectations of these potential clients. The impact of such co…

> I take it that you're not a "person who wears a suit"?

I'm a person whose life experience tells me anyone wearing a suit is, to a very high degree of probability, evil, stupid, or both.

Do your justifications work both ways or not? If it's just fine to discriminate against someone for not wearing a suit, is it equally fine for me to discriminate against someone for wearing a suit?

> the business will need to conform to the expectations of these potential clients

If people would stop appeasing these idiots and instead do the ethical thing by telling them to take a hike, it wouldn't be an issue.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#49

Post by cheald »

md224 wrote: post #40
cjensen wrote: post #26

His boss fired him and told him why? Never do that. When firing someone in an at-will state, just do it and explain nothing. Explanations can easily lead to lawsuits. It's just not worth the risk.

Unrelated to the validity of this advice: it's kind of sad that our society has evolved legal structures that make it prohibitively risky to tell another human being why you're taking an action against them. Hmm... what if you could have an employee sign a release as a precondition of being told why they were fired?

Then you'd have them sign it before you fire them for a bullshit, actually-worthy-of-a-lawsuit reason.

Re: Why I Was Fired From a Tech Startup and What My Boss Had to Say About It

#50

Post by greenyoda »

epoxyhockey wrote: post #33

One of the more frustrating things about working in the Bay Area is having to deal with finicky personalities like the OP's boss & CEO. It really takes a psychopath to court a potential hire so hard and then fire them 5 weeks later due to their appearance (after they sign a couple of large customers, btw). If this were NYC, I could understand stabbing someone in the back after they secure a couple of large customers.…

"If this were NYC, I could understand stabbing someone in the back after they secure a couple of large customers."

Why would that make sense in NYC or anywhere else? If someone brought in some large customers, I'd expect them to be able to bring in more large customers in the future. Firing someone with that track record would just be stupid.

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