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Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

theguardian.com

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Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#201

Post by davidw »

rolux wrote: post #197
davidw wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While obviously, mafias and governments work on the same problem Bullshit. You'd do well to read more about the Mafia and how it affects places where it's strong. They are badly governed, and generally not good places to live or do business as an honest person. Denmark has a strong government that is quite involved in its citizens lives, but the number of them that end up dead, tortured, with their lives ruined, an…

Trust me, I know such places, and I have no romantic notion of the Mafia. But I think there's a way to compare things that doesn't equate them. Same for the Greenwald quote in the grand-grand-grand-...-parent.

The quote only serves to show that the person in question knows little to nothing about actual mafias. Or - more likely - was understandably caught up in the heat of the moment and didn't research what he was writing. He's wrong, but I'd certainly cut him some slack.

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#202

Post by jacquesm »

davidw wrote: post #155
calibraxis wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the US's murderous sanctions against Iraq (and nuking Japan, for that matter): Lesley Stahl: "We have heard that half a million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?" Madeleine Albright: "We think the price is worth it." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_Iraq#Albright... ) Dissidents (those who Greenwald praises) point out that…

Inane comments like this are one of the many reasons why political discussions on HN are so bad. The thinking that most politicians are just like people who would take a 12 year old boy and dump him in a vat of acid after strangling him is shallow and devoid of any depth of thinking on how different organizations operate. States do dirty things, and so do individuals, and so do organizations on various levels. But th…

Berlusconi is pretty deep in bed with the Mafia and would not be where he is without them.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/03/25/uk-italy-mafia-tria...

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#203

Post by arcadeparade »

omonra wrote: post #145
GhotiFish wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People did not catch that joke. I think the issue was that you didn't go far enough. The internet has people who would say something like that and mean it. It wasn't absurd enough to be dismissed.

Thank you :) I really don't know anything beyond genocide I could muster (we don't have a word for holocaust of entire humanity, do we?)

Capitalism :p

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#204

Post by davidw »

jacquesm wrote: post #202
davidw wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inane comments like this are one of the many reasons why political discussions on HN are so bad. The thinking that most politicians are just like people who would take a 12 year old boy and dump him in a vat of acid after strangling him is shallow and devoid of any depth of thinking on how different organizations operate. States do dirty things, and so do individuals, and so do organizations on various levels. But th…

Berlusconi is pretty deep in bed with the Mafia and would not be where he is without them. http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/03/25/uk-italy-mafia-tria...

"It's complicated". He's a fairly rotten guy in many ways; in all likelihood he's made deals with them, but isn't at all involved in their actual operations.

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#205

Post by mcphilip »

throwit1979 wrote: post #82
jacquesm wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder from how high up this order came. After all, it's not like Greenwald is going to take this lying down and that's something that they could predict quite accurately ahead of time. To abuse these powers on the partner of the journalist that is reporting the abuses is the worst tactical mistake made by any government to date, short of the diversion of a diplomats plane. Taking into account that the UK law enfor…

the worst tactical mistake made by any government to date Why would this be a tactical mistake? The general public DOES NOT GIVE A FUCK. The government(s) know(s) this quite well. If you think for a second that detention of associates of political enemies matters to an electorate far more interested in the minutiae of Kanye West's baby, you're living in a fairy land of your own making.

The typical reaction I've seen is snark. The most memorable one was a Facebook post:

"I don't care if Obama reads my text messages. All he'll learn is how to sext."

Most of the "smart" people I know, both in and out of the tech industry, are more interested in Egypt, Syria, and the large drop in US stock market indices last week.

How sad is it that Orwell's dire portrayal of Big Brother is no longer as relevant to most people as following reality TV's Big Brother...

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#206

Post by arcadeparade »

rmc wrote: post #61
k-mcgrady wrote: post #3

I'm shocked that police actually have the power to hold you for nine hours, refuse you a lawyer and that you are not allowed to refuse to answer questioning. Edit: shocked is probably the wrong word it's hard to get surprised by this stuff anymore.

I'm shocked that police actually have the power to hold you for nine hours, refuse you a lawyer and that you are not allowed to refuse to answer questioning. You haven't read up much history of Northern Ireland? There is a lots of examples of the UK and anti-terrorism laws. Imprisonment without trial, etc.

Not to mention the Dublin and Monaghan bombings.

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#208

Post by chrismonsanto »

jacquesm wrote: post #185
throwit1979 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first, obviously, is swift and violent revolution. Historically speaking, totalitarian power has only ever succumbed to greater power. Obviously this is not an option I would advocate or consider. Nor is it an option that's even possible. Drunk NRA members with Mini-14s versus the US Naval Carrier Fleet, USMC, and USAF, all of which are provided with dossiers on high value targets sympathetic to the cause provide…

Maybe you should stop the heavy drinking. Swift and violent revolution? That'll work just dandy, let me go get my AK-47 out of the storage grease. FFS don't talk nonsense and if you must don't do it here.

You're attacking a strawman, since he made it quite clear that he wasn't calling for swift and violent revolution: "Obviously this is not an option I would advocate or consider. Nor is it an option that's even possible."

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#209

Post by dsuth »

rdtsc wrote: post #169
jacquesm wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder from how high up this order came. After all, it's not like Greenwald is going to take this lying down and that's something that they could predict quite accurately ahead of time. To abuse these powers on the partner of the journalist that is reporting the abuses is the worst tactical mistake made by any government to date, short of the diversion of a diplomats plane. Taking into account that the UK law enfor…

2 tests perhaps and a warning. I suspect they are a step ahead, and actually did think this through. Whether it will backfire or not is up to the citizens to decide. But I suspect it won't backfire enough to cause a dent. 1) A test to see how the journalist will react and to flush out more information. I.e. force him to disclose more information so they know what he has. 2) Another test is to test public opinion. So…

Another possible pre-meditated outcome:

4) Highlight the fact that Greenwald is in an openly gay relationship in an attempt to discredit him / colour what he's saying in a personal light. Sadly, a large part of the conservative base will cling to this I think.

Re: Detaining my partner: a failed attempt at intimidation

#210

Post by legutierr »

throwit1979 wrote: post #82
jacquesm wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder from how high up this order came. After all, it's not like Greenwald is going to take this lying down and that's something that they could predict quite accurately ahead of time. To abuse these powers on the partner of the journalist that is reporting the abuses is the worst tactical mistake made by any government to date, short of the diversion of a diplomats plane. Taking into account that the UK law enfor…

the worst tactical mistake made by any government to date Why would this be a tactical mistake? The general public DOES NOT GIVE A FUCK. The government(s) know(s) this quite well. If you think for a second that detention of associates of political enemies matters to an electorate far more interested in the minutiae of Kanye West's baby, you're living in a fairy land of your own making.

I'm kind of confused by what you consider the "general public" here.

Right now, in addition to this being the top story on HN, it is is on the default reddit front page at #9 and rising. It's also on the front page of the New York times website, and also in the top three headlines at news.google.com. Google reports 25 articles most being published in the last hour.

By these measures, it seems to me that a lot of people are rather interested in the story.

Now, I understand that you may not consider "the population that consumes its news on the internet" to be equivalent to the "general public". But any argument about that question is a much larger one than an argument about the public's interest in this particular story.

The fact is, even amongst all of the tabloid trash real news stories do matter to people, and people who consume cotton candy celebrity media for entertainment can also be consumers of hard news. The existence of one doesn't preclude interest in the other.

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