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“People simply empty out”

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Re: “People simply empty out”

#71

Post by thetrb »

medell wrote: post #36
blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

"I wish I worked more" - said no one ever on their death bed.

Well, maybe someone who got fired because of poor work ethics and then never got a job again and died in poverty said it before.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#72

Post by wwweston »

mason240 wrote: post #52
enraged_camel wrote: post #32

>>You know my old saying, "Slavery was never abolished, it was only extended to include all the colors." Some people balk at the idea of "wage slavery," primarily because they think it is so different from the traditional slavery that it should not be called that. But the question is, if you are doing something and the alternative is starvation and death, are you really a free human being? If you think about it for a…

I'm curious to know just how you think humanity will be able to feed, shelter, and entertain itself if no does anything.

If literally no one did any work, then yes, we'd have trouble with this.

However, most industrial societies, things are long past the point where most people would need to work full time in order to feed and shelter their populations -- we now employ a decided minority of the labor force doing those essentials.

Apparently instead of reaping a leisure dividend, though, we've decided other things are more important. Perhaps some of them even are.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#73

Post by _delirium »

dictum wrote: post #67
_delirium wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really more impractical for a 70-year-old to work 25 hours, than for a 60-year-old to work 40 hours? The latter is widely expected today, and we expect 60-year-olds to work as hard as 25-year-olds. Otherwise, we'll hire the 25-year-old over them. If that's a problem, we should change it across the board. Note that this proposal is also in the context of a system that provides full support for job retraining and…

Sorry, I misread your comment. I had understood it as "work more as you get closer to 80", and not the inverse, which is the premise of his suggestion. Maybe wanting to stop working at 65 and step into full retirement is particular to the American system. Most 70 year olds I know would like some kind of job/retirement hybrid: work 30 hours a week, have longer vacation times, more flexible hours, not losing the job wh…

Ah right, I see that reading now. I didn't mean that working hours is proportional to age; just that you work "proportionally less" pre-65 in the sense that you work more post-65 than the current norm of "none", and then reallocate those extra person-years of productivity to reduce the pre-65 work week.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#74

Post by pyoung »

djim wrote: post #55

i sold my startup about 3 months ago, and immediately starting looking for another job. after a couple months, a couple interesting but-not-exciting offers, and one interview process that ended in me not getting an offer, i finally took a worthy vacation. while on a boat in the caribbean, a couple things occurred to me: (1) i really don't need to work for the next ~10 years (2) in that time, i will likely stumble on…

I am currently taking a sabbatical of sorts after slaving away and saving up for 5 years. I threw most of my savings into index funds, and then set up automatic withdrawals to my savings account. This forces me to try and live within a certain budget. If all goes well (i.e. market stays healthy), I will have only spent down a small amount of my savings by the time I return to the labor force. In the mean time, I have been taking some coursera classes, toying with some side projects, and doing some R&R. I highly recommend it for people who can afford to do this.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#75

Post by lotharbot »

eropple wrote: post #70
enraged_camel wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Anyone can do it. Correction: anyone who graduates without debt and starts their careers making good money can do it.

And is willing to live in fairly shitty places. (You're not retiring on $25K a year in any part of Boston, NYC, Seattle, or any other reasonably vibrant urban area without making brutal compromises in terms of quality of life.)

There are plenty of areas that are cheaper than Boston, NYC, or Seattle, and yet not "fairly shitty".

For example, $25k a year can be quite comfortable in Denver, which is a reasonably vibrant urban area.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#76

Post by javert »

Afforess wrote: post #21
Casseres wrote: post #14

Today, too many people have jobs to support their lifestyles, not their lives. People end up working to continue making monthly payments on houses larger than they need, cars fancier than they need, and they won't be able to fully enjoy those things because they're always working 9-5. Today, we are a lot further along than we were 50 years ago. People aren't working in factories to put bread on the table, people are…

People buy things they can't afford, with money that they don't have, to impress people that they don't like I realized I could live off of $25000/yr and maintain a modestly comfortable lifestyle at the same time. I am on track to retire before I am 40. Anyone can do it. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/02/22/getting-rich-from-...

If I may ask, where do you live? Do you have family to support?

I am under the assumption I could do it a lot cheaper if I were to choose not to have a family and to live in rural or semi-rural North Carolina.

(Edit: I picked North Carolina becuase that's where I already am.)

Re: “People simply empty out”

#77

Post by philwelch »

enraged_camel wrote: post #32

>>You know my old saying, "Slavery was never abolished, it was only extended to include all the colors." Some people balk at the idea of "wage slavery," primarily because they think it is so different from the traditional slavery that it should not be called that. But the question is, if you are doing something and the alternative is starvation and death, are you really a free human being? If you think about it for a…

There's no state of nature where people are free from starvation without having to work. Even hunters and gatherers have to hunt and gather.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#78

Post by njharman »

rollo_tommasi wrote: post #69
blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

I think you've missed the point of the letter entirely. It's not about people who are obsessed with their work, it's about people who have no choice in the matter.

No, it's about a system, capitalism, that gives most no choice in the matter.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#79

Post by karlkatzke »

medell wrote: post #36
blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

"I wish I worked more" - said no one ever on their death bed.

"I wish I achieved more" -- said a large number of people as they died.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#80

Post by zoba »

They never pay the slaves enough so they can get free, just enough so they can stay alive and come back to work.

I do love my job, though there is so much more I want to do with my life - so much more I could do that (as far as I can tell) would really help humanity. Unfortunately I'm locked into working because of student loans and overall cost of living. I try to do work in my free time but sadly 3 hours a night does not build a company with enough revenue to grant me freedom.

By the time I've earned enough from my job to afford not having a job I worry I'll have moved on to a different life stage where kids will take up my evenings.

I know I'm not the only talented, driven 20-something in this situation and with student loans recently so high, it is a pity to think that overall out generation will have fewer who are able to make their ideas real because of it. Thanks to YC for offsetting that effect and helping us believe we can "get free".

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