A Coder's Guide to Coffee • Hacker News Board

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#21

Post by gdee » Thu, May 21, 2009, 2:34 PM UTC

discojesus wrote: post #10

chaosmachine wrote: post #2

If you find "mainstream" coffee enjoyable, is it really in your best interest to raise your expectations? If you suddenly find normal coffee lacking, have you really improved your life?

I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally (allow me to repeat this to nip the obvious retorts in the bud - to ME, PERSONALLY :P) it hasn't made one bit of difference. I still use a french press, but that has a lot to do with convenience. I just don't grind it fresh anymore or spend tons of money on fresh-roasted beans - a bag of 8 O'Clock Colombian works just fine. So you might find that…

> I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally ... it hasn't made one bit of difference.

You mean you actually roasted good greens, let them degass, ground them correctly and pulled espresso shots (at the right temp./pressure) and found them to have not one bit of diff from regular, supermarket/sb coffee?

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#22

Post by proee » Thu, May 21, 2009, 2:35 PM UTC

Another Tip: Try an Aeropress

Designed by the same guy who came up with the aerobie, it makes very good espresso shots (add water for americano) and it costs about 25 dollars. The great thing about espresso vs. french press or drip is that it's much less acidic so you're stomach will thank you.

http://www.aerobie.com/Products/aeropress_story.htm

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#23

Post by discojesus » Thu, May 21, 2009, 2:38 PM UTC

gdee wrote: post #21

discojesus wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally (allow me to repeat this to nip the obvious retorts in the bud - to ME, PERSONALLY :P) it hasn't made one bit of difference. I still use a french press, but that has a lot to do with convenience. I just don't grind it fresh anymore or spend tons of money on fresh-roasted beans - a bag of 8 O'Clock Colombian works just fine. So you might find that…

> I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally ... it hasn't made one bit of difference. You mean you actually roasted good greens, let them degass, ground them correctly and pulled espresso shots (at the right temp./pressure) and found them to have not one bit of diff from regular, supermarket/sb coffee?

No I was specifically referring to the first part of the article, about obtaining fresh-roasted beans, grinding them, and then brewing them in a french press using water off the boil.

The article writer alleges that that process improves your daily coffee significantly - I related my own experience, which was to the contrary.

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#24

Post by bena » Thu, May 21, 2009, 2:46 PM UTC

You can do packaged coffee right. This is pretty much the only coffee I drink now. It is semi-regional to the South, but anyone who tries it becomes an instant fan.

http://www.communitycoffee.com/ccc/Catalog_CS/coffee-detail/...

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#25

Post by philwelch » Thu, May 21, 2009, 2:52 PM UTC

swombat wrote: post #5

mseebach wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite the opposite, in my experience. The more really good wine I try, the less I'm able to enjoy cheap wine. These days I prefer water over cheap wine, unless I'm specifically trying to get drunk. The same with coffee... after discovering freshly ground French press, I'll drink and really enjoy two cups a day, rather than the 6-10 cups of stale filter coffee I'd drink previously.

Yes. And the reason why you enjoy the quality coffee more than the cheap filter stuff is because it is more pleasurable. That is also the reason why you don't enjoy the cheap stuff anymore - because you know that it's actually pretty bad. You can still drink it anyway, but you know it's not that good. Suggesting that this is a bad thing is kind of suggesting that you don't think your tastes should evolve for the bett…

"Yes. And the reason why you enjoy the quality coffee more than the cheap filter stuff is because it is more pleasurable. That is also the reason why you don't enjoy the cheap stuff anymore - because you know that it's actually pretty bad. You can still drink it anyway, but you know it's not that good. Suggesting that this is a bad thing is kind of suggesting that you don't think your tastes should evolve for the better throughout your life. "

You're assuming that enjoyment and happiness always improve when drinking better coffee/wine/beer/etc. Untrue. If you're perfectly happy with what you have now, cultivating a more sophisticated taste will usually just frustrate you because now to get the same level of enjoyment you had previously you have to spend more money or time. Going back to what you had before doesn't return you to a baseline level of happiness, it makes you unhappy. To get back to the baseline you now have to regularly consume expensive or time-consuming coffee instead of the cheap stuff.

If your goal in life is to enjoy the "finest things", go right ahead. If your goal in life is to be happy, then be very careful about raising the bar for things that you enjoy. Being able to enjoy cheap crap makes you just as happy as being able to enjoy expensive crap, but at lower cost.

(As it turns out, this argument doesn't apply to books and movies and music because good books, movies, and music cost just as much as the crap ones, and because good art is intellectually stimulating, which is worthwhile for its own reasons.)

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#26

Post by gdee » Thu, May 21, 2009, 3:00 PM UTC

discojesus wrote: post #23

gdee wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally ... it hasn't made one bit of difference. You mean you actually roasted good greens, let them degass, ground them correctly and pulled espresso shots (at the right temp./pressure) and found them to have not one bit of diff from regular, supermarket/sb coffee?

No I was specifically referring to the first part of the article, about obtaining fresh-roasted beans, grinding them, and then brewing them in a french press using water off the boil. The article writer alleges that that process improves your daily coffee significantly - I related my own experience, which was to the contrary.

Oh ok. The "all" and "one bit" threw me off. And the creamy, 4 days old hand-roasted, Yellow Bourbon SHB double shot made me answer. :)

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#27

Post by Shooter » Thu, May 21, 2009, 3:04 PM UTC

proee wrote: post #22

Another Tip: Try an Aeropress Designed by the same guy who came up with the aerobie, it makes very good espresso shots (add water for americano) and it costs about 25 dollars. The great thing about espresso vs. french press or drip is that it's much less acidic so you're stomach will thank you. http://www.aerobie.com/Products/aeropress_story.htm

I make cold-brew coffee sometimes, which also lessens the acidity of coffee (supposedly by 67% or so.) It is especially good if you ever make iced/frozen coffee drinks, because you can adjust the concentrate ratio and get a much richer taste as cold coffees go. I also like the Aeropress, but my wife prefers the cold-brew method so we probably do that more often. We're trying to cut down on both, though. I recently read a couple of studies that say that unfiltered coffee increased your risk of heart disease, because the diterpenes raise your serum concentrations of cholesterol, triacylglycerols, and alanine aminotransferase.

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#28

Post by tortilla » Thu, May 21, 2009, 3:05 PM UTC

colonhyphenp wrote: post #15

discojesus wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've tried all the stuff mentioned in the article, and to me personally (allow me to repeat this to nip the obvious retorts in the bud - to ME, PERSONALLY :P) it hasn't made one bit of difference. I still use a french press, but that has a lot to do with convenience. I just don't grind it fresh anymore or spend tons of money on fresh-roasted beans - a bag of 8 O'Clock Colombian works just fine. So you might find that…

I am in the same boat with the french press - I really can't tell that much of a difference between a cup of freshly roasted/ground french press coffee and a cup of coffee at Starbucks. However, I recently switched to an Aeropress single cup coffee maker, and it is a HUGE difference - it makes a small concentrated cup of coffee with very little bitterness, and brings out the coffee's natural sweetness. Also, I find i…

Yep, I did the same. The French Press was great and all, but I couldn't produce a good cup consistently and it was quite messy. Didn't particularly like the grit either. Have been using the Aeropress for about 4 months straight and really love it. The flavors are great, clean up is quick and painless. Now I'm thinking about roasting my own beans. A local roaster recommended the Behmor: http://www.sweetmarias.com/prod.behmor.php

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#29

Post by swombat » Thu, May 21, 2009, 3:12 PM UTC

philwelch wrote: post #25

swombat wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. And the reason why you enjoy the quality coffee more than the cheap filter stuff is because it is more pleasurable. That is also the reason why you don't enjoy the cheap stuff anymore - because you know that it's actually pretty bad. You can still drink it anyway, but you know it's not that good. Suggesting that this is a bad thing is kind of suggesting that you don't think your tastes should evolve for the bett…

"Yes. And the reason why you enjoy the quality coffee more than the cheap filter stuff is because it is more pleasurable. That is also the reason why you don't enjoy the cheap stuff anymore - because you know that it's actually pretty bad. You can still drink it anyway, but you know it's not that good. Suggesting that this is a bad thing is kind of suggesting that you don't think your tastes should evolve for the bet…

Good food is also intellectually stimulating (at the very least, many gourmets will agree). In addition, good food is often healthier, more balanced, etc.

I'd say that in many, many cases, "better stuff" has many other advantages than simply being considered better.

I actually am not a big fan of expensive coffee, because I can't taste the difference between a good cup of coffee and an excellent cup of coffee. And some people are not big fans of expensive wine because they can't taste the difference between a bad wine and a good wine. But I don't feel I'm superior to people who can taste the difference. In fact, I'd say I'm inferior - my range of experiences in my life is poorer than theirs - at least when it comes to coffee.

Honestly, I don't see how you can present the ignorance of better things as an advantage, except in are really base, utilitarian way, where we are all hamsters on the hedonistic treadmill with no higher aspirations beyond immediate pleasurable gratification.

Re: A Coder's Guide to Coffee

#30

Post by pasbesoin » Thu, May 21, 2009, 3:26 PM UTC

At its simplest, e.g. at the office, I use a $2 (oops, $3, now) Melitta single cup brewer. (1)

http://www.amazon.com/Melitta-64007B-Single-Coffee-Filter/dp...

All it requires is a cup, a number 2 filter, and ground coffee. Hot water is fairly ubiquitous, e.g. from the hot water / tea tap on the officer coffee machine. I also use a measuring cup (ok, this is getting complicated) to ensure I am not pouring in too much water, which would make a mess.

At the office, grinding is not convenient. So I bring pre-ground coffee in "flavor seal" type bag; this an impervious (plastic/foil combination, typically) bag that has a one way valve that allows for pressure from the outgassing of CO2 to escape. For example, Starbucks, Caribou, and the like all sell their pre-packaged beans in these types of bags (not that I'm recommending them especially, but most people have probably seen the packaging; in fact, I believe "flavor seal" may be a Starbucks mark).

To help keep the coffee fresh, after dispensing a dose into the filter, I press the air out of the bag (out of the top; the valve is not high enough capacity for this) while folding the top over repeatedly until I have the folds down fairly tight against the remaining grounds. Then I rubber band the folds into place. This removes most of the air, and outgassing further reduces O2 content as it sits.

The coffee stays reasonably fresh until it is consumed -- I'm also not adverse to the flavor changes as it "ages" as long as that process does not go too far. With a minimum of fuss, I get a much better cup of coffee than the office can provide.

If you grind your coffee but hate the mess of grinds getting all over the place, try placing the grinder inside a container like a Tupperware casserole pan or similar. The grounds only get as far as that container, which is easily wiped out.

I have a big old beast of an Italian espresso machine, but I found it to just be too much hassle and mess. It sits in the corner of the counter, in need of a descaling.

Cash is tight for me, right now: When I have a bit more disposable income, I'd like to try:

Aerobie Aeropress

http://www.amazon.com/AeroPress-Coffee-and-Espresso-Maker/dp...

Pump and Seal Food Saver Vacuum Sealer

http://www.pump-n-seal.com/

The latter to keep the beans fresh.

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(1) All links are free of any referral ID's or any benefit to me. Just provided FYI.