I quit my job • Hacker News Board

Re: I quit my job

#111

Post by dkrich » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:09 PM UTC

guynamedloren wrote: post #84

fixxer wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm actually fairly serious. I've been bored before, so I hear you. But, I guess I'm kind of surprised that you chose to jump into nothing rather than parlay your way to something else. Seems a little impulsive. Impulsive is a red flag, despite what many on HN think (you can be impulsive, but you better be brilliant too). Now you've got to explain a gap in your res to a potential employer (should you choose to go tha…

I tend to be fairly transparent and vocal. Sometimes it gets me into trouble, but usually it works out for the best. If a potential employer asks why I left my job (which I entirely expect), I will be straightforward. Heck, I'll even send them a link to the blog post. I'll tell them how I don't think sticking to what is easy is the best approach to building a successful business, even though it feels safe. I'll tell…

I think in the long run you'll be fine. Red flags are a lot less important than ability to solve the company's problems. As much as it pains me to say it, once you move out of the startup arena into large company territory time off matters even less because most people who will interview you know very little about specific technologies and just want the hiring phase to be over with. Some won't even ask you about your time away from work. Those that do will give you a "heh, that's interesting" and move on to the next question.

Generalizing is usually pretty pointless but if I were banking on getting a programming job, were debt free, and okay with not being especially picky about what company I work for after the experiment should it come to that, I wouldn't worry too much about possible red flags.

In life you have to prioritize things. If your highest priority is running your own business or taking time off from work to try something new, then your next job after that really has to fall down the priority list. You can't have everything assured and hope to be successful. Edit: MOST PEOPLE can't have everything assured and hope to be successful. Of course there are exceptions to every rule, but most of the time you do have to experience trade-offs to be successful. I'm not advocating taking huge risks, and most of the time there are smart ways to mitigate risk, but in the end I think a lot of people are arguing you should mind your red flags and try to stay focused on getting your dream job after the hiatus. I'm simply saying that isn't realistic if you want to focus on being successful in a different line of work. I've always believed you can really only be truly committed to one career at a time.

Re: I quit my job

#112

Post by dustingetz » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:13 PM UTC

jbail wrote: post #85

guynamedloren wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People seem to have this idea of lavish Zynga style life styles. It's not. It's really really hard work. Yes, I absolutely agree with you. But in this particular case, I didn't leave because it was hard. I left because it was easy. Too easy. I wasn't challenged. The work I was doing was mundane and repetitive, and I didn't feel like what I was working on was important (or fulfilling). My productivity was great. I e…

But at the end of the day, I was just another dev. This. A thousand times. At every company I've EVER worked for, I eventually had this exact same feeling. Even as the lead engineer, team lead, tech lead, or whatever other "top developer" role I've held, I always feel like this. And I always eventually quit too. It's gotten worse in the past few years. I can barely make it one year before I feel like "just another de…

it's also possible that you (and Loren) are victims of Dunning–Kruger. How do you know that you aren't?

I only ask because I am in a hardcode engineering lead role and have never been made to feel like "just another dev"

Re: I quit my job

#113

Post by invalidOrTaken » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:14 PM UTC

Tehnix wrote: post #102

I can relate all too well. I once got hired in a startup my brother was in. I relocated to a new town (the capital), and got the chance to work in the development team with my brother and another guy I also knew very well. Things were awesome, and I couldn't be happier. After awhile though, my motivation started declining quickly, and I found it hard to get up in the morning. By that time, I had almost stopped entire…

Regarding your job dichotomy: yes! My two favorite jobs ever: working at Starbucks, and freelancing. I would rent my brain out, but it's not quite under my control.

Re: I quit my job

#114

Post by jedc » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:18 PM UTC

FD3SA wrote: post #93

MartinCron wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something very similar happened to me at a startup a few years ago and it took me a long time to realize what had happened and why I felt so terrible about it. Even though my title, salary, and perks were still the same, it was a de-facto demotion . Important parts of my compensation (involvement, agency, sense of ownership, diversity in work effort) were just inadvertently phased out as the company I helped grow was…

It would be criminal negligence if I didn't mention Michael O'Church's seminal work on this issue [1]. There is surprising depth and complexity to the power dynamics in companies, both large and small. What you've discovered first hand is that, unfortunately, politics determine the fate of nations and companies alike. 1. http://michaelochurch.wordpress.com/2013/02/19/gervais-princ...

I'm sorry, but it's really difficult to take that "seminal work" seriously when that work is an in-depth analysis of the "MacLeod Model of organizational sociology".

Do you know what the "MacLeod Model" is? A cartoon on the back of a business card, posted to the web without comment nine years ago: http://gapingvoid.com/2004/06/27/company-hierarchy/

Michael O'Church might have some interesting things to say, but when he extrapolates pages of meaning from a cartoon that's just trying to be humorous, it says more about Michael O'Church than anything else.

Re: I quit my job

#115

Post by skrebbel » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:22 PM UTC

FD3SA wrote: post #93

MartinCron wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something very similar happened to me at a startup a few years ago and it took me a long time to realize what had happened and why I felt so terrible about it. Even though my title, salary, and perks were still the same, it was a de-facto demotion . Important parts of my compensation (involvement, agency, sense of ownership, diversity in work effort) were just inadvertently phased out as the company I helped grow was…

It would be criminal negligence if I didn't mention Michael O'Church's seminal work on this issue [1]. There is surprising depth and complexity to the power dynamics in companies, both large and small. What you've discovered first hand is that, unfortunately, politics determine the fate of nations and companies alike. 1. http://michaelochurch.wordpress.com/2013/02/19/gervais-princ...

Now that you mention michealochurch, his stinch as an active HN commenter was short and powerful, wasn't it?

Haven't seen much from him lately.

Re: I quit my job

#116

Post by scott_s » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:30 PM UTC

btipling wrote: post #83

guynamedloren wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People seem to have this idea of lavish Zynga style life styles. It's not. It's really really hard work. Yes, I absolutely agree with you. But in this particular case, I didn't leave because it was hard. I left because it was easy. Too easy. I wasn't challenged. The work I was doing was mundane and repetitive, and I didn't feel like what I was working on was important (or fulfilling). My productivity was great. I e…

Mundane is hard, and working at a startup can require mundane work. Lots of it. Automate whatever you can whenever you have time.

The main benefit for working at startup is supposed to be working on interesting things. The author no longer felt that he was working on interesting things. This is very different from thinking the work was too hard.

Re: I quit my job

#117

Post by dnautics » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:32 PM UTC

andywood wrote: post #103

rwg wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Just quit" doesn't always work out so well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5778653 If I've learned anything about working, it's that you never quit without another job lined up. Employment seems to be a prerequisite for finding employment.

I don't know about this. So far I've left jobs with nothing lined up 4 times. That's every time. So far, finding work hasn't taken more than a couple months of dedicated searching. Maybe I've gotten lucky, but it hasn't seemed that difficult. Uncertain and scary at times, yes. Actually difficult, no.

Agreed. Its n=2 for me but about to be 3. I'm in the sciences, not tech though.

Re: I quit my job

#118

Post by count » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:33 PM UTC

tlrobinson wrote: post #62

coherentpony wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a fair point, but with this approach one is left with a gap of unemployment in their CV. Unfortunately, even in today's economic climate, a gap in your CV is still seen as a negative to many employers.

For software developers the "CV gap" problem (if it really is a problem) seems easily solvable to me: do a little freelancing, and put that in the gap.

Um, or just put 'years' not 'months':

Corp X: 1999-2004 Corp Y: 2005-2009 Corp Z: 2009-2013

Last day at X could have been 12/31/2004, last day at Y could have been 1/1/2009, first day at Z could have been 12/31/2009, but no 'suddenly suspicious gap' shows?

Re: I quit my job

#119

Post by jdotjdot » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:44 PM UTC

guynamedloren wrote: post #106

vinceguidry wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You didn't really read the post. When she started, it was like that. But eventually it turned into "just-another-9-to-5" with uninteresting problems. That's why she quit.

I'm a 'he' :)

you have a fantastic HN handle

Re: I quit my job

#120

Post by FD3SA » Thu, Aug 08, 2013, 9:59 PM UTC

jedc wrote: post #114

FD3SA wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be criminal negligence if I didn't mention Michael O'Church's seminal work on this issue [1]. There is surprising depth and complexity to the power dynamics in companies, both large and small. What you've discovered first hand is that, unfortunately, politics determine the fate of nations and companies alike. 1. http://michaelochurch.wordpress.com/2013/02/19/gervais-princ...

I'm sorry, but it's really difficult to take that "seminal work" seriously when that work is an in-depth analysis of the "MacLeod Model of organizational sociology". Do you know what the "MacLeod Model" is? A cartoon on the back of a business card, posted to the web without comment nine years ago: http://gapingvoid.com/2004/06/27/company-hierarchy/ Michael O'Church might have some interesting things to say, but when…

I enjoy Michael's descriptions because they provide a conceptual understanding of very profound evolutionary principles. As someone who understands the difficulty in simplifying evolutionary psychology for non-experts, I sincerely commend him for his work.

I would classify Michael's work as an introduction to applied evolutionary psychology, using corporations as a case study. If you'd like the reasons behind why his work is valid, I'd recommend starting with Richard Dawkins' Selfish Gene followed by The Extended Phenotype. The sections on game theory are particularly insightful, as they describe how competing strategies reach equilibrium in a given environment. You will find the strategies described are quite similar to Michael's classifications, thus shedding much light on corporate environments.