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Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
11–20 of 32 posts
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#12Unfortunately this article requires paying money to read if you are not a subscriber. I don't think there's anything wrong with me writing my own--original--free ending to the free preview: Those links mean that instead of communicating through Internet pipes run by ISPs, that communication is completely free. Further, any peer can connect with any other peer. So as peers join up, the network grows. Eventually if one…
What is the point of creating such network if it is for the benefit of just a few ? If 1% of the population can have free speech, but the rest of them don't, nothing will change...
More importantly, what's the point of building pipes if nothing flows through them. I don't think there is a YouTube or a HN over there. One may imagine that users may share files they have on their discs, or more generally serve stuff, but then you depend on them being up and running (and reachable) 24/7.
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#13Question:
Could it be interesting to have the main project leaders set up a website allowing everybody to pay hackers to come to your home and set up the required equipment ready-to-use?
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#14Could someone clarify what the purpose of a meshnet is? Only encryption of all the contents? Or also hiding who talks to who? That last one seems quite difficult to achieve to me, in the presence of an attacker that permeates the network (the internet).
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#15Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the point of creating such network if it is for the benefit of just a few ? If 1% of the population can have free speech, but the rest of them don't, nothing will change...
More importantly, what's the point of building pipes if nothing flows through them. I don't think there is a YouTube or a HN over there. One may imagine that users may share files they have on their discs, or more generally serve stuff, but then you depend on them being up and running (and reachable) 24/7.
I can see that problem solved or attenuated if those meshes turn into some kind of distributed networks like bitmessage or bittorrent where everyone has duplicate pieces of a larger "file" thus ensuring almost 99% availability. Data put in the network would be everywhere and maybe a distribution algorithm could ensure that there's always a complete source on one node so the swarm could be rebuilt if one node goes down.
Of course the bandwidth will be nothing like what ISP can offer.
What concerns me is how highly vulnerable to RF disruption some of those projects relying on WiFi are. This is a serious problem if you are trying to communicate vital information in a country where the government is hell-bent on not letting citizens set up counter-revolt or grass-root movements because it'll actually be very cheap to disturb those signals (I may be wrong but from what I understand of WiFi freq. range it's easy to neutralize a network by flooding it with interference).
edit: But maybe we don't need 24/7 availability for those kind of network usage. Well-organized revolutionary and underground movements might not need a youtube or facebook uptime.
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#16Could someone clarify what the purpose of a meshnet is? Only encryption of all the contents? Or also hiding who talks to who? That last one seems quite difficult to achieve to me, in the presence of an attacker that permeates the network (the internet).
The main purpose is to have a network without depending on a central ISP.
A good example of a sizable meshnet is the Athens Wireless Metropolitan[1] network which has more than a thousand backbone nodes.
1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens_Wireless_Metropolitan_Ne...
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#17Could someone clarify what the purpose of a meshnet is? Only encryption of all the contents? Or also hiding who talks to who? That last one seems quite difficult to achieve to me, in the presence of an attacker that permeates the network (the internet).
No central control. Point to point. It's like amateur radio communication where two people can talk directly with each other radio to radio.
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
More importantly, what's the point of building pipes if nothing flows through them. I don't think there is a YouTube or a HN over there. One may imagine that users may share files they have on their discs, or more generally serve stuff, but then you depend on them being up and running (and reachable) 24/7.
I can see that problem solved or attenuated if those meshes turn into some kind of distributed networks like bitmessage or bittorrent where everyone has duplicate pieces of a larger "file" thus ensuring almost 99% availability. Data put in the network would be everywhere and maybe a distribution algorithm could ensure that there's always a complete source on one node so the swarm could be rebuilt if one node goes dow…
> What concerns me is how highly vulnerable to RF disruption some of those projects relying on WiFi are. This is a serious problem if you are trying to communicate vital information in a country where the government is hell-bent on not letting citizens set up counter-revolt or grass-root movements because it'll actually be very cheap to disturb those signals (I may be wrong but from what I understand of WiFi freq. range it's easy to neutralize a network by flooding it with interference).
Plenty of WIFI networks are sub-optimal because the people implementing them don't know what they're doing with channels and power etc. I'm worried that meshnet activism will attract many people who are keen but not clueful.
See also "IETF Attendees Re-Engineer Hotel WIFI" (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3771876) (https://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/032812-ietf-makeover-...)
I agree that it feels like jamming WIFI would be trivially easy for people with even moderate skills and resources.
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#19Remember when WiMax was being discussed? How come it still isn't being sold yet? Could it be that it's because providers felt threatened?
I suppose it would take meshnets to a whole new level.
Re: Meshnet activists rebuilding the Internet from scratch
#20Mesh would be much more stable and efficient when it's based not on voluntary free-of-charge participation (like bittorrent, which does not work well for not-very-popular items), but on economics. If everyone pays everyone in Bitcoin for bandwidth and storage, the competition among computer enthusiasts would create a robust working network with lowest prices possible without any fancy algorithms to detect "leechers" and "seeders".