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Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

money.cnn.com

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Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#41

Post by bazillion »

lotsofcows wrote: post #36
bazillion wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing this post made me very happy, actually. I've commented before about my perspective in the NSA and doing government work, but immediately get showered with downvotes because I have a point of view that differs from what other people have been rallying towards. I don't understand the motivation behind preventing discussion of actual facts or interesting points of view. If 11 year old BBS-hacking NSA-conspiracy-f…

Have a different opinion to you is not close-minded. Being unwilling to discuss ones opinion sensibly, eg labelling those whose opinions differ to yours as "close-minded", is close-minded.

Please re-read what I wrote and what I responded to. It was a post which was being downmodded because people didn't agree with his opinion, and I was opposing those who were suppressing his opinion. As in, those that were downmodding rather than supplying discussion content were close-minded.

This isn't supposed to be reddit, where people downmod something because it is an opinion that they don't agree with.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#42

Post by Gonzih »

precisioncoder wrote: post #31
Gonzih wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't understand how someone can be proud about modern Russia in any way.

Bad doesn't cancel out good, they exist side by side. I admire the US for it's amazing alternative culture (steampunk, goth, robots, anime, comic books, oh my). I admire it for it's incredible technological innovation. I have often weighed those things against the lack of support for it's citizens (No free healthcare, little to no vacation, often mandatory overtime, rich wins legal system, etc). I don't know as much…

> I don't know as much about Russia...

Unfortunately I know about Russia too much. I totally agree with you, but from my point of view and with information that I'm getting about Russia I can't see how to look at that country from positive perspective.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#43

Post by huhtenberg »

oleganza wrote: post #20
huhtenberg wrote: post #17

It's the same douchebag that was making paper airplanes out of real money, throwing them from his office window and then going all ecstatic over people on the ground fighting each other for these planes. Yeah, it's once in a lifetime opportunity for Snowden. Woo. Hoo.

I worked with Durov in 2007 and 2008 (making everything for the VK video service; I moved to Paris after getting bored managing 200+ servers in 3 datacenters). He is a brilliant guy, however he's also eccentric. And his brother's ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Durov ) sysadmin/system programmers team is one of the best in the world as far as I can say. Unlike Facebook, VK guys are still capable to work in a v…

I don't doubt he is not a usual person, but taking glee at people fighting over money that you throw out of the window is hardly "eccentric". But then 2008 was 5 years ago and people change fast.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#44

Post by cpursley »

precisioncoder wrote: post #31
Gonzih wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't understand how someone can be proud about modern Russia in any way.

Bad doesn't cancel out good, they exist side by side. I admire the US for it's amazing alternative culture (steampunk, goth, robots, anime, comic books, oh my). I admire it for it's incredible technological innovation. I have often weighed those things against the lack of support for it's citizens (No free healthcare, little to no vacation, often mandatory overtime, rich wins legal system, etc). I don't know as much…

Well, you can be proud Russia has a very sane 13% flat national tax system while the US has incomprehensible tax code.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#45

Post by adestefan »

olalonde wrote: post #37
melling wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't get how people can be so naive on HN. Let's talk about Snowden all day and wish we were more like Russia, where it's perfectly ok to say anything you want. Sorry guys, but not every one really believes the NSA should be disbanded. They have a real job to do. Certainly there needs to be limits, which we could of course discuss for years on end, but I don't see the point of doing it in a forum that reall…

> Ok, back to the echo chamber. 4 downvotes and this message disappears. Well, I do need to try occasionally. HN used to be a great site. I'm sorry but this kind of comment is what makes HN worse. From the HN guidelines: "Please don't bait other users by inviting them to downmod you."

Except they're correct. HN has always been an echo chamber and the groupthink here is thicker than most places.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#46

Post by lvturner »

Gonzih wrote: post #42
precisioncoder wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bad doesn't cancel out good, they exist side by side. I admire the US for it's amazing alternative culture (steampunk, goth, robots, anime, comic books, oh my). I admire it for it's incredible technological innovation. I have often weighed those things against the lack of support for it's citizens (No free healthcare, little to no vacation, often mandatory overtime, rich wins legal system, etc). I don't know as much…

> I don't know as much about Russia... Unfortunately I know about Russia too much. I totally agree with you, but from my point of view and with information that I'm getting about Russia I can't see how to look at that country from positive perspective.

Go visit Russia, it's hard to evaluate any country based on information gleaned from the outside.

Edit: Actually, by visit, I mean go and live there for a while

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#48

Post by oleganza »

huhtenberg wrote: post #43
oleganza wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked with Durov in 2007 and 2008 (making everything for the VK video service; I moved to Paris after getting bored managing 200+ servers in 3 datacenters). He is a brilliant guy, however he's also eccentric. And his brother's ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Durov ) sysadmin/system programmers team is one of the best in the world as far as I can say. Unlike Facebook, VK guys are still capable to work in a v…

I don't doubt he is not a usual person, but taking glee at people fighting over money that you throw out of the window is hardly "eccentric". But then 2008 was 5 years ago and people change fast.

Opinion about someone throwing money out of the window works both ways: the more you dislike how one guy caused others to fight over paper, the more you should dislike fighters for what they do.

Unlike ancient times when a king throwing money around would be the same person who robs his citizens, Durov did not steal from anyone. Everyone who was fighting for money are responsible for their free choice. Durov is responsible only for throwing paper bills out of the window. Anyone who was harmed during that voluntary gathering, was harmed by greedy dudes, not by pieces of paper.

PS. Imagine if Durov set up a charity organization that gave away money to people based on some criteria. This would have some competition among people. Some of them will attempt to eliminate competition by defaming them, or blackmailing, or brutally fighting. Would Durov be responsible for all this fight around "free" money, or would actual fighters be responsible?

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#49

Post by oleganza »

precisioncoder wrote: post #32
nakedrobot2 wrote: post #15

Is Putin Russia's Obama, as well?

Sure I guess, after all it's basically just who runs the largest social network in the country. I guess Putin is the Obama of Russia in that he's the man in charge there.

Excuse me for anarchistic correction here.

None of them is a man in charge. Both of them think of themselves as being "in charge". And maybe some "voters" even support that idea. But that does not change matters for those who didn't vote for or support them (including all foreign citizens). For them, Putin/Obama are just bullies from high school. Most of the time they don't have to do anything with your life, but sometimes their associates in form of judges/cops/army/etc are coming to you and forcing you to do things you don't approve. E.g. sponsoring a war, or "national project", or having your money diluted by inflation or something else.

Re: Russia's Mark Zuckerberg offers Snowden a job.

#50

Post by throwaway9848 »

melling wrote: post #27
D9u wrote: post #10

"In such moments one feels pride with our country and regret over the course taken by United States -- a country betraying the principles it was once built on," Even Russians get it... Why don't more Americans get it?

I really don't get how people can be so naive on HN. Let's talk about Snowden all day and wish we were more like Russia, where it's perfectly ok to say anything you want. Sorry guys, but not every one really believes the NSA should be disbanded. They have a real job to do. Certainly there needs to be limits, which we could of course discuss for years on end, but I don't see the point of doing it in a forum that reall…

And it would be one thing if it were a country that had any sort of positive track record on privacy protection. The idea that Russia of all places should be used as an example of privacy protection vs. the US is _hilarious_.

I mean, off the top of my head: Gazprom/Rosneft, Anna Politkovskaya, Alexander Litvinenko... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_R...

And that's not to even just generally discuss the FSB, which is a proportionately larger and more corrupt version of the CIA and NSA combined. Just imagine if Bush or Obama were a former CIA officer, and had used a loophole in the Constitution to stay in power for more than a decade.

Russia's human rights and privacy rights are deplorable. Good for Snowden and his sense of realpolitik, but let's not pretend this is anything more than nation-state theater.

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