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Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

schneier.com

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Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#11

Post by twoodfin »

tkellogg wrote: post #8
twoodfin wrote: post #6

It's interesting to compare the framing of this column with Schneier's commentary on the revelations of NSA surveillance in 2005: http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2005/12/nsa_and_bushs_... It's full of "Bush did X", "Bush wanted Y". Now he says the NSA has "gone rogue". Huh. If Schneier is as unhappy with today's programs as he was with 2005's, then perhaps he should communicate a bit more clearly that today's o…

I don't think its as simple as "ending it with a phone call". Billion dollar programs don't ever get killed that easy.

It is literally that simple. If Bush ordered this surveillance started, Obama can order it stopped. The NSA works for him. If they don't do as he asks he can start firing people until they do.

Obviously Schneier understood this when he wrote his 2005 column.

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#12

Post by Zigurd »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #7

A lot of people in tech want to complain about innovation. Why are there so many Farmville apps and nobody seems to be solving important problems? Well here you are, the biggest and most important problem in modern society today, the fact that our governments are recording most everything that we're doing. And they will use these recordings as they see fit in the future. You couldn't ask for a bigger or more importan…

It's solvable, too. If they are interested in having credibility, Internet services can implement secure communications and storage. They may have to charge for it because they will forego some ad revenue.

So what to make of the fact that nobody who has loudly declared they are all for customers' privacy has actually done anything about it?

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#13

Post by Shivetya »

coldpie wrote: post #10

From the article: "Accountability means that those who break the law, lie to Congress or deceive the American people are held accountable. The NSA has gone rogue, and while it's probably not possible to prosecute people for what they did under the enormous veil of secrecy it currently enjoys, we need to make it clear that this behavior will not be tolerated in the future. Accountability also means voting, which means…

NSA? It seems as if as a whole the Executive branch has. From ignoring laws, selectively enforcing them, or even delaying when they take effect, the Executive branch seems hell bent on ignoring Congress and the Courts. Congress doesn't get a free pass either, but for any Executive branch persons to lie either directly or by omission should not be acceptable.

I guess we should have realized the day we got Czars

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#14

Post by DanielBMarkham »

Zigurd wrote: post #12
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #7

A lot of people in tech want to complain about innovation. Why are there so many Farmville apps and nobody seems to be solving important problems? Well here you are, the biggest and most important problem in modern society today, the fact that our governments are recording most everything that we're doing. And they will use these recordings as they see fit in the future. You couldn't ask for a bigger or more importan…

It's solvable, too. If they are interested in having credibility, Internet services can implement secure communications and storage. They may have to charge for it because they will forego some ad revenue. So what to make of the fact that nobody who has loudly declared they are all for customers' privacy has actually done anything about it?

Don't forget mesh networking. Seems like mesh with a combination of trusted anonymous P2P would be very difficult to tap into.

There's lots of nerd fun here for those interested. And there's a big need. A shame more folks aren't stepping up to the plate.

Just to whet the appetite, how much of the internet do you actually participate in, versus just consume? Most server stats show a 40-1 or even 200-1 ratio of readers to commenters. And how much unique material is really out there, anyway? I'd bet a couple hundred MBs of text represents the vast majority of internet content most consumers passively consume each day.

So why all of this client-server, point-to-point nonsense? For most consumption content, do some kind of BT for common content distribution, then use some other solution if a consumer wants to send information the other way.

I understand many will yell "But that violates the TOS!" but screw 'em. If whenever I get on the internet all my information is being stored against my will, I have no obligation to abide by any subsequent agreement.

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#15

Post by chmike »

maxk42 wrote: post #2

Why on earth would you want people to trust the government? That's what got us into this mess.

There is indeed no other way than to trust the governmnet, but the tools and means to verify should be there too, and they aren't. We should not accept to be forced into blindly and naively trust the government in a claimed democracy.

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#16

Post by denzil_correa »

The common pattern in the responses of most organizations is "word play".

Skype -

    Skype wasn't changing its protocols to make it possible for the government to eavesdrop on users, 
    because the government was already able to eavesdrop on users.
Google and Facebook-

    Google and Facebook insist that the NSA has no "direct access" to their servers. Of course not; the 
    smart way for the NSA to get all the data is through sniffers.
Apple-

    Apple says it's never heard of PRISM. Of course not; that's the internal name of the NSA database.
I am surprised that such large organizations are using "word play" to put a veil on their activities. Are they not aware that they would be found out in this Internet age? Personally, I think this would make an interesting social science study.

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#17

Post by angersock »

jstalin wrote: post #5

We should be able to trust the government to do things like run courts, build roads, and deliver clean water. We should never trust the government when it comes to standing armies, criminal prosecutions, intelligence gathering, and expansion of its own power.

Interesting username to post a sentiment like that--and no idea why you're getting downvoted. :(

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#18

Post by perlpimp »

jstalin wrote: post #5

We should be able to trust the government to do things like run courts, build roads, and deliver clean water. We should never trust the government when it comes to standing armies, criminal prosecutions, intelligence gathering, and expansion of its own power.

very true, government suppose to service us just like an excellent butler. when butler starts snoop around and do more harm than good , then it is the time to get rid of said butler and find a new one. for example I would think it would be dispeakable if my security guard and/or butler would be reading emails just to "service" me better.

Governments do benefit from some visceral punishments from time to time. But not all societies have the will and strength to stand up to the government and put them in their place.

Re: Restoring Trust in Government and the Internet

#19

Post by harrytuttle »

angersock wrote: post #17
jstalin wrote: post #5

We should be able to trust the government to do things like run courts, build roads, and deliver clean water. We should never trust the government when it comes to standing armies, criminal prosecutions, intelligence gathering, and expansion of its own power.

Interesting username to post a sentiment like that--and no idea why you're getting downvoted. :(

Probably because of the user name entirely.
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