I have worked with Goldman and UBS. UBS, to it's credit, has taken a liberal stance and explicitly addresses contributions to Open Source : if they are done on your own time, that's fine. Goldman, in contrast, had the usual, "anything and everything you do or do not belongs to us" agreement.
Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
51–60 of 228 posts
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you sure about that? Do non-Americans have the same rights as Americans? Can they refuse to talk to the police, refuse to let the police into their home without a warrant, have an attorney present, ...?
Yes, all persons on US soil are to be protected by the constitution. (Not withstanding specific incidents of abuse, the fact that one is, or isn't a citizen is not intended to have any effect on the constitutional rights available.)
Is it really as simple as this in practice? Does anyone have any experience with this? As a foreigner, I have huge respect for the amount of trouble that the immigration authorities can cause for you if they figure they don't like your face.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
My understanding is he copied a bunch of confidential code off company servers and then deleted the audit trail from the servers. He claimed that the confidential code copied was accidental and that he only meant to copy some open source code.
That's inaccurate. I just read the Lewis article and there are plenty of facts recited there contradict your summary; none of those facts support it. He deleted his bash history, which many programmers do every day, indeed, that's what the justice department used as evidence that he "deleted the audit trail" Once you look at the details of this case--in fact, even just the details as recited in the public documents f…
In our industry( HFT ) generally, you sign all sorts of agreements which specifically prohibit you from taking any code whatsoever from your employer without specific authorization to do so. Michael Lewis article almost makes it sound like its Goldman's fault. But the fact is, he signed agreements that prohibited him from doing stuff like this and then did it anyway
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a little harsh to say he deleted the audit trail. He deleted his bash history. Something I do on a near daily basis.
The exact details (which aren't disputed) are covered in: http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/021110aleyn... Basically he'd written a backup program which was specifically designed to compress both his home directory and propriety code from elsewhere on the system into a file (which it would do depended on parameters passed). On his last day of employment he ran it several times with different parameters…
It's hard to believe he did it accidentally. He probably just underestimated GS's reaction and didn't think it was a big deal. Firms like GS and other HFTs are excessively sensitive about their IP - especially the code base. Whenever an employee leaves, especially to go to a competitor, they're going to have a team of people checking what that person did. When you get in bed with the devil, you need to accept the rules.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#55Man, talk about risks computer programmers don't usually consider in taking a job on wall street.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's inaccurate. I just read the Lewis article and there are plenty of facts recited there contradict your summary; none of those facts support it. He deleted his bash history, which many programmers do every day, indeed, that's what the justice department used as evidence that he "deleted the audit trail" Once you look at the details of this case--in fact, even just the details as recited in the public documents f…
In our industry( HFT ) generally, you sign all sorts of agreements which specifically prohibit you from taking any code whatsoever from your employer without specific authorization to do so. Michael Lewis article almost makes it sound like its Goldman's fault. But the fact is, he signed agreements that prohibited him from doing stuff like this and then did it anyway
if he really wanted to take only open source code, he could have cleared it with his managers and his compliance officer, and they would have let him take stuff that is clearly open source most likely.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, all persons on US soil are to be protected by the constitution. (Not withstanding specific incidents of abuse, the fact that one is, or isn't a citizen is not intended to have any effect on the constitutional rights available.)
Is it really as simple as this in practice? Does anyone have any experience with this? As a foreigner, I have huge respect for the amount of trouble that the immigration authorities can cause for you if they figure they don't like your face.
The law is that simple. Actual practice may not be -- but talking to the cops sure didn't help the guy in this story, did it? It made things worse. A lot worse.
But yeah, if the government wants to fuck with you, they can surely fuck with you. Your best defense is getting a lawyer asap and not talking to the cops without a lawyer.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#58As an attorney and someone moderately interested in politics, it's becoming more and more clear that technical literacy is going to play a huge role in law and policy. We desperately need more politicians, bureaucrats and law enforcement who at least have some basic technical knowledge. Empathy is the only way to prevent stuff like this.
Usually people who attain technical knowledge are the same type to avoid politics.
Politics is a "soft" game of imperfections, where as technical knowledge is the opposite. Cold, hard, objective.
What incentive is there for technically-equipped folk to deal with the imperfections and heartache of interacting with non-technical folk than to take a white collar job amongst other technically-minded folk?
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#59This makes me angry. Not just the story itself, but the way VF goes about telling it, which commits the same sins (albeit with better intent) as Goldman Sachs. "So-called 'subversion repository'?" Why don't we just accuse him of summoning demons while we're at it?
Michael Lewis is a great writer about economics. He appears to have gotten out of his depth here.
Re: Did Goldman Overstep in Criminally Charging Its Ex-Programmer?
#60And now he's being charged by the state of New York. This will never end as long as Goldman Sachs continues to pull the strings, I fear.