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Obama Promises Disappear from Web

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Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#171
post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BTW, if anyone was unreasonable about their expectations that he'd be different, it was those who were afraid. They believed he would take their guns, was a Communist, not born in the U.S., raised taxes when he actually lowered them, etc. They were so made afraid about the difference he would make that they formed a party to "take their country back". And, they continued to believe in wild conspiracy theories, even i…

>>> They believed he would take their guns He's still trying to undermine both gun ownership and self-defense rights. He is now vocally opposing Stand Your Ground - the principle he himself supported and helped strengthening while in the state senate by sponsoring a law: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/354059/obama-voted-stre... He is still advocating severely limiting and restricting access to guns. It's not hi…

He did not sweep in and take everyone's guns as was the meme at the time. People were literally stockpiling AR-15s and ammo because they believed this.

Stand Your Ground is a horrible law that's ripe for abuse. That's become more evident since his days in the State Senate. Likewise, there wasn't a "shooting spree of the month" at the time. Things have changed, and I would want someone who can reassess and change his position when conditions require. Still, the main point is that conservatives believed in change as much as progressives. It is just the flip side of the same coin: progressives welcomed the change to gun laws and conservatives were rabidly opposed to it. That's the case with much of this discussion.

Regarding taxes, the point is that many on the right (especially Tea-partiers) believed their taxes were higher even when he had actually lowered them across the board. They literally named themselves after a tax revolt because they were so angry that he was raising taxes when in truth he'd lowered them.

How cartoonish is that? But, that was the extent to which they, also, believed in "change". Even facts couldn't sway them from their doggedly held beliefs that he was a socialist who was taxing them to give money to poor people.

Finally, it is far from a "tiny minority" who believed that he was a socialist, outright communist, muslim (as if that were inherently evil), non-U.S. born, etc.

For instance a 2011 CBS poll showed that 45% of Republicans believed he was born in another country.

These conspiracy theories and right wing attacks to paint him as "other" were clearly successful and they contributed greatly to the sense that this man was, indeed, different. For a progressive who was on the fence about whether he was different, the rabid fear and irrational reaction of the right served as evidence that maybe this man was legitimately about change if he so irked the right.

That you act as if none of this happened is incredible. Funny that you mentioned "sleight of hand".

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#172
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are changing the subject here to all of the reasons you don't like Obama. Your original point was that there was no reason for people to expect that he'd be different from any other politician. Every piece of information that I give you to that effect is turned into a rant about how Obama is a racist, opportunist, etc. OK, we get it. You don't like Obama. Beyond that, you are simply backing into your conclusion t…

Believe me, if I wrote all the reasons I dislike Obama, it would be comparable in size to a George Martin novel. Yes, I dislike him. But that does not make what I say about him untrue - in fact, the reason I dislike him is exactly because these things are true, I don't have any personal animosity towards him. But these not all the reasons - these are only the reasons why anybody who is willing to look clearly into th…

You bought the same bill of goods that Obama was selling. The only difference is that you didn't like it.

Truth be told, I have reverted to my unhealthy political cynicism post-first term Obama. Unlike you, however, I acknowledge the transformational atmosphere of 2008 that virtually anyone in the country would recognize.

I mentioned the Tea Party and Bush for reasons that I thought I had made clear, but you apparently still miss the point. Has nothing to do with blaming them for him not being transformational, but I don't want to keep repeating myself.

Finally, I hope that you realize how ridiculous it is that you are pointing to some ex-classmate or ex-colleague gossip on The Daily Caller. That is very "Fox News Viewer" of you. This is why Swift-boating works. Just drudge up some old people that knew the target in a past life but don't agree with his politics, and let them spout off what detractors want to hear. Then, canonize that into the truth and its attendant panoply of talking points.

Of course we can dig up plenty of people who say the exact opposite. This is not evidence of anything. What did he do or not do that supports the conclusions you have drawn about him? You are suggesting that people were foolish to believe he was different because there's no evidence that he would be. Yet, you offer no evidence that he would not be. It's just these declarations that he is not who he says because you, Fox News, and (now) some guys/gals he knew years ago say so.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that psychopaths and Obama share certain characteristics does not prove that Obama is a psychopath. Yet people continue to suggest that he is, citing the incongruent logic that overlapping characteristics imply equality. The fundamental problem is not people's flawed logic, but the psychological diagnostic tests. Psychologists broadly categorize most disorders because they cannot find a reliable symptom that…

ITT: Armchair psychologists confuse "psychopathy" and "sociopathy". The tops of government and business exhibit the signs of sociopathy, not psychopathy. Psychopaths generally exhibit many behaviors that makes them fundamentally unsuited for public life, such as poor behavior control. Sociopaths, on the other hand, have just the right mix of anti-social tendencies to turn their empathy on for the crowd, and off while…

every discussion I've seen about this has inevitably come to the conclusion that psychopathy and sociopathy have entered the public consciousness, and have ceased being relevant diagnostic terms.

Every description I've seen of sociopaths and psychopaths is basically parallel.

My recommendation is to jump ship and avoid talking about psychopaths and sociopaths, and just stick to new material coming out about the spectrum of anti-social personalities.

Starting at the word psychopath or sociopath will get you to the relevant material, but those terms in and of themselves are not considered relevant anymore.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#174
post #56
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He isn't going to be charged with treason.

Ok, let’s say they charged him with of "aiding the enemy" . That also carries the death penalty. Who knows what kind of trumped up charges the government where planning to throw at him. But there's no way he'd be getting a fair trial, so why on earth would he be offering himself up for trial.

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