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As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

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Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#181

Post by Vivtek »

jwoah12 wrote: post #165
northernmonkey wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tepid? The response has been cooler than that.

I don't know what would have to happen for you to consider the response substantial. Would citizens need to be forming militias and actively marching in the streets? That's just not how people react anymore. Tens of thousands of people called their congresspeople on a day's notice to express their support for the Amash Amendement. That amendment lost by only 12 votes. A large majority of people polled think that the…

Tens of thousands caring out of a population of 350 million is 0.03% of the population. That's kinda tepid. But should Paula Deen have been fired from Food Network? Crisis of epic proportions!

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#183

Post by chongli »

untog wrote: post #134
chongli wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're talking about the media, what did you expect? The mainstream media is just a mouthpiece for the government at this point.

I know that's a popular thing to say, but the mainstream media broke the story . In what way are they a government mouthpiece?

You're right, it is a sweeping generalization. It'd be better to say that most of the mainstream media serves as the government mouthpiece. A few key outlets continue to serve the vital role of breaking important stories such as this one.

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#184

Post by fab13n »

toble wrote: post #148
fab13n wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you say is true, but misses an important consideration: yesterday, only tinfoil hats believed they couldn't trust third-party companies with their privacy. Today, everyone knows that the only way to have privacy is to handle it personally, from their local computer. The whole PRISM scheme worked because people supposed the government respected their privacy. Now that it's been proven false, I expect people to us…

Even on your local computer, it's probably a good idea to avoid operating systems that may be compromised by default. Also be careful about installing extra software, including browser plug-ins and addons. I am preaching to the converted though.

> it's probably a good idea to avoid operating systems that may be compromised by default.

It is if you're targeted. But then, if the US government is after you, you're already screwed anyway.

The point is to impede generalized surveillance of everyone without probable cause. Even if MS-Windows and OSX are bugged, which is almost certain, the NSA can't siphon all your data through your routers inconspicuously. It can only grab selected data from the computers of high-value targets, at a considerable cost, which is fine.

It's not about preventing states from surveilling legitimate suspects, it's about forcing them to respect the privacy of average joes, and limiting their control on the Internet as a whole.

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#185

Post by squozzer »

macspoofing wrote: post #73

Does the Federal government not understand that this (idiotic) mass scale surveillance is bad for business? All the big American companies generate most of their revenue outside of the US. Majority of the user-bases of the big Silicon Valley tech companies are foreign. This only works if there is a level of trust in the American system and American government. What are they thinking?!?!

Your assertion (a correct one in my view) probably explains a good bit of the vitriol about Mr. Snowden's recent disclosures.

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#186

Post by lttlrck »

fab13n wrote: post #180
downandout wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Today, everyone knows that the only way to have privacy is to handle it personally, from their local computer. I agree with you, but I think you have far too much faith in ordinary Americans. I invented some widely used anti-phishing technology, and I can tell you that spending a few months analyzing actual incidents where otherwise intelligent people did ridiculously unsafe things on the Internet will give you a n…

OK, I should have written "everyone that matters"; the point is to have a critical mass of expensive-to-eavesdrop communications, so that the NSA cannot routinely exploit much more than teenager gossips traded through Facebook. Moreover, even if only the 10% best informed people use PRISM-proof communications, it's a safe bet that NSA's alleged targets (whatever the current definition of "terrorist" might be) are amo…

Define "everyone that matters"

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#187

Post by rayiner »

jwoah12 wrote: post #165
northernmonkey wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tepid? The response has been cooler than that.

I don't know what would have to happen for you to consider the response substantial. Would citizens need to be forming militias and actively marching in the streets? That's just not how people react anymore. Tens of thousands of people called their congresspeople on a day's notice to express their support for the Amash Amendement. That amendment lost by only 12 votes. A large majority of people polled think that the…

Not even 500 people made it out to support the July 4 protest of the NSA, in a country where tens of thousands of people will turn out to oppose gay marriage.

Depending on what polls you read, a majority of Americans think the NSA policy is acceptable: http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/most-americans-suppor.... ("Overall, 56 percent of Americans consider the NSA’s accessing of telephone call records of millions of Americans through secret court orders 'acceptable,' while 41 percent call the practice 'unacceptable.')

The real news here is that Congress reacted more strongly than the public!

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#188

Post by rayiner »

moens wrote: post #168
chongli wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're talking about the media, what did you expect? The mainstream media is just a mouthpiece for the government at this point.

Unfortunately I believe @northernmonkey and all OP's are talking about the "average American" and maybe the "average human". After all, in the US anyway, aren't we-the-people the government? That would make the MSM a mouthpiece for... the average American. I believe that is more or less true as sad as it is. Aware and concerned tech-heads are trying to protect a drunken fool (the public) from a hungry bear (whoever i…

> Aware and concerned tech-heads are trying to protect a drunken fool (the public) from a hungry bear (whoever it is that actually runs the intelligence networks).

What self-important, self-aggrandizing bullshit.

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#189

Post by jessaustin »

Vivtek wrote: post #181
jwoah12 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what would have to happen for you to consider the response substantial. Would citizens need to be forming militias and actively marching in the streets? That's just not how people react anymore. Tens of thousands of people called their congresspeople on a day's notice to express their support for the Amash Amendement. That amendment lost by only 12 votes. A large majority of people polled think that the…

Tens of thousands caring out of a population of 350 million is 0.03% of the population. That's kinda tepid. But should Paula Deen have been fired from Food Network? Crisis of epic proportions!

You might want to consume different sources of news media. The only times I've heard the name "Paula Deen" was in conversation with my parents and grandparents. I'm sure her travails (whatever they are or were) amount to a crisis for some people, but you don't have to pay attention to those people.

Re: As Feds Demand the Keys, Preparing for the Death of Public-Key Encryption

#190

Post by lttlrck »

cmircea wrote: post #62
evgen wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think that operating in any particular jurisdiction provides you with protection then you are sadly deluded. Your protection lasts just up until the point where protecting you becomes inconvenient. Oddly enough, using the resources of smaller companies provides less protection because they are easier to influence, and basing services outside of the US means that you are completely fair game for the NSA as you…

The NSA itself has exactly zero power outside the USA.

Key sentence: "Your protection lasts just up until the point where protecting you becomes inconvenient."
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