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Existential Depression in Gifted Children

davidsongifted.org

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Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#62

I cried a little. I'm 18 and since 3rd grade I was in a special class for gifted children. I know this feeling so well, from my experience and from those of my classmates and friends, it literally hurts. I'm no psychiatrist but from my nonobjective personal experience depression in gifted children and your regular "normal" teenage depression are completely different, in symptoms as well as in cause, which I think the…

Just don't get too used to thinking being gifted is particularly rare and requires a different system to thrive. Many acquaintances of mine at a certain crimson ivy university grew up with similar notions, and got into a different kind of depression once being surrounded by other 'gifted' individuals - due to having the 'world view' they've internalized so far, around the notion of them being special, getting totally crushed. Many also got used to explaining away their flaws as somehow being related to them being brilliant. This notion of specialness being crushed, they also saw those thing for what they are - failings, i.e. that they fail to connect with young people their age due to poor social skills, and not due to them gifts; and this becomes obvious now that others around them are also smart, etc. They realized that even if you're 1/1000 this means Facebook could staff the entire company with even more gifted Americans, and you'd still not make it, and so on.

These people are also crushed to learn upon graduation that people don't automatically revel in their obvious greatness, and that they need to earn their place by actually delivering / 'executing' on some of that potential.

TL;DR: Smart teenagers tend to not realize they are still 99% teenager, 1% smart. That itself is a teenager like habit.

Humans have roughly similar meta-emotional makeups and thrive in environments that cater to this. Gifted or not, children and teenagers thrive where they can expand their social, intellectual, emotional, spiritual boundaries and capabilities in a trusting, safe, encouraging environment. Thus the 'system' is the same, the gifted merely require a different mix of 'content'. They may be advanced in certain ways but normal or behind in others.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#63

The only two real issues I've got with this article are that it limits itself in scope to the "gifted" and that it limits itself to children. As for the latter issue, I suspect that this may fit into a broader work or area that the author presumes readers are familiar with--these issues are certainly seen in teenagers and afterwards. As for the first point, a bit of a cliche but still accurate is the saying "The rain…

If you're knowledgeable of something, you may not know what it's like to be ignorant about it, but you do recognize the ignorance itself. But this doesn't go both ways, it's rather like a big circle contains the area of a smaller one, but not the other way around. You can see "blind" people, but they can't really see you. They hear and feel some things, and think that's all there is to it, but you know there is more. That is, after you found out about their blindness by them walking over paintings you made, maybe even made as a gift for them. Or even worse, you see them falling into manholes every day, and each time you tell them about it, especially in the blunt way of kids, they attack you for "thinking you see something they don't, thinking you're better". This is even more true for adults being showed up by kids; the people who can deal with that are rare, most use their position or power to shut the kid up, or eave it at a stupid, patronizing, insulting response.

Needless to say, this can be very confusing and painful. It's not like anyone ever tells you "I'm acting this way because I feel threatened by you", it's always some stupid mind fuck and always your fault. I still would never say it hurts more than being stupid, and let's not forget the perks that come with being gifted, either... I don't disagree with what you said, but still: "just as dire" does not mean "exactly the same".

There are, by definition, more people who can understand the most stupid, than those who who can understand the most gifted, and the sadness of seeing how the world could be, and how it is, and how third-hand many of the excuses many people make are, that is not a feature of the other extreme. Ignorance is bliss, as they say. And just consider the likely very different reactions to "I'm sad because I'm more stupid than the people around me" and "I'm sad because the people around me are more stupid than me". Both are perfectly valid reasons to be sad, but only one of them tends to get a hissy-scratchy response, especially when it's true.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#64
I have to point out that a good percentage of people seem to gravitate towards religious, spiritual, mystical, or other basically non-reason-based thought patterns, I suspect to help alleviate this sense of existential hopelessness. Perhaps these "gifted children" find it harder to go down that particular route, for obvious reasons.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#65
I have felt those things before but then one day I had an epiphany. Everything in this universe, living or dead, are all made of the same universe, like gems cut from the same rock. So that even when I find myself having difficulties with someone, something or even idea, I remind myself that we're all in this together. The universe is us, its what we choose to make of it. The universe isn't just one state of the universe but rather the transitions between one state after another, just like how a movie isn't just the current frame I see, but rather all the frames put together, and although the movie is going to end, we don't know how the story is going to go. That part, is up to us, so let's create something beautiful.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#66
I'm not saying I was ever overly gifted, I was just a very introvert child who spent a lot of time thinking and through that became depressed about my seemingly pointless existence.

Well I just wanted to say that what helped later in adult years was discovering true love. I know it sounds corny but once you realize that life on this earth is short, and that short time can be used to experience great feelings of love and togetherness with other humans, you do feel less depressed about it.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#67
post #65

I have felt those things before but then one day I had an epiphany. Everything in this universe, living or dead, are all made of the same universe, like gems cut from the same rock. So that even when I find myself having difficulties with someone, something or even idea, I remind myself that we're all in this together. The universe is us, its what we choose to make of it. The universe isn't just one state of the univ…

I also had an experience where the existential depression went away. I thought this comment on the original article described it pretty well:

The solution to existential depression is counter intuitive, which is probably why it isn't well known. Existential depression is caused by wanting to have meaning when a part of us knows that meaning doesn't exist. We grow up in a life where everyone around us jumps from one 'important' and 'meaningful' thing to another, never seeing the pointlessness of it all. We think this is normal so adopt the behavior, but we constantly fight ourselves because part of us sees how pointless it really is. Our base state is where we see how pointless everything is. However, this state does not create existential depression. It's the conflict between the pointless state and the part of us that wants meaning that creates existential depression. We enter suicidal states only when we are unable to find a solution. (i.e. we are unable to find something that has meaning.) The solution, which is now obvious, is to remove all feelings of meaning and importance so that we return to our natural state. If everything is meaningless than everything is unimportant. If everything is unimportant than nothing is more important than anything else. When the feelings of meaning and importance are removed, our existential depression disappears.

Basically it felt like the abstract notions I had been worrying over were indeed meaningless, but that the meaningful world from when I was a little kid was still around, when I could capture the same intense non-verbal awareness.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#68
post #57
post #34

> it is because substantial thought and reflection must occur to even consider such notions, rather than simply focusing on superficial day-to-day aspects of life. What elitist garbage.

Really? I read it nodding, thinking of how many of my friends/family/cow-orkers, and if I'm being honest with myself - me a lot of the time, could be described perfectly as "simply focusing on superficial day-to-day aspects of life."

Day-to-day life isn't superficial to everyone.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#69

While I've read a fair bit of existentialist works I've never seen this term, but I think I know what it means. I also think the article would be improved by just titling itself "Existential Depression". The narrow focus is odd, even if true, and might serve better as a footnote. There's the strangest feeling I come across from time to time, and I think "come across" is the only good way to describe it. Everyone has…

> But with the cosmic sadness there is no going up one level, it's all there to ponder and still real. No snapping out of it.

There are two mechanisms to cope with this without discarding or distorting it. Both are linked to accepting and expanding the comical (and cosmic) smallness of our existences.

The first one I actually learned recently from reading Stephensons Anathem (which made me wonder if I'm reading that into his work or whether it was put in there from the same urge to cope). It's a bit hard to relay it without spoiling the book too much, but let's say it's related to the fact that even our understanding of the heat death of the universe is based on and limited by our human brains. There is hope in understanding it as a field that may still be ripe for discovery (top-of-my-head exmples: quantum immortality, parallel universes etc.) and that, as per usual, reality is always more fascinating, weird and grand than our brains can even begin to imagine. (And maybe these short term sprints of depression stem from being unable, for a short while, to muster an appropriate sense of wonder.) We're along for a ride and that ride is awesome.

While the first one is going one step ahead, the second is taking one step back: Even the fact that we are able to form thoughts about the heat death of the universe means that we are incredibly gifted and that it's a gift we should not waste on despair. We are part of a universe that is to all appearances without inherent meaning or even sense. Fine. It's up to you to decide whether you want to dwell in and facilitate the static and the cold, or whether you want to pump your energy into showering it with the most fantastic entropy that the universe hasn't seen yet. You are here because thousands of generations of humans have found ways to cope and carry on and make today into a better tomorrow. If they figured out a way to give a damn, you can, too.

Re: Existential Depression in Gifted Children

#70
post #65

I have felt those things before but then one day I had an epiphany. Everything in this universe, living or dead, are all made of the same universe, like gems cut from the same rock. So that even when I find myself having difficulties with someone, something or even idea, I remind myself that we're all in this together. The universe is us, its what we choose to make of it. The universe isn't just one state of the univ…

I also had an experience where the existential depression went away. I thought this comment on the original article described it pretty well: The solution to existential depression is counter intuitive, which is probably why it isn't well known. Existential depression is caused by wanting to have meaning when a part of us knows that meaning doesn't exist. We grow up in a life where everyone around us jumps from one '…

I echo all of that.

Do you not also feel that sometimes it's hard to consciously think that it is pointless and to feel yourself accidentally drifting back into a state of trying to find meaning... to feel this existential depression creeping back?

I find it takes constant awareness (not effort) to maintain an idea that it is all futile and pointless, to allow me to exist without any depression.

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