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Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

nytimes.com

11–20 of 36 posts

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#11
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While I really like this kind of articles I don't like the search for single or few causes of intelligence or creativity. Happily human beings and the world in general is more complex and trying to absolutely follow what these studies say is a bad idea.

People who downvote without adding a reply...

You received (now) a kind and thoughtful reply about why your top-level reply was deemed not constructive for the current discussion. (I didn't vote on that comment. Certainly I did not downvote it.)

Subsequent comments bringing up solely the issue of being downvoted are being downvoted on sight, because those sorts of comments are never constructive to the discussion and are disfavored by the site guidelines.

http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

"Resist complaining about being downmodded. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading."

By the way, the premise is false that there is any rule here against downvoting without commenting. Implicitly, some comments should be downvoted on sight.

http://ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

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The site founder has commented that downvotes for disagreement are permitted here.

(In order of time of posting, with the last post quite recent.)

"I think it's ok to use the up and down arrows to express agreement. Obviously the uparrows aren't only for applauding politeness, so it seems reasonable that the downarrows aren't only for booing rudeness."

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171

"IIRC we first had this conversation about a month after launch. Downvotes have always been used to express disagreement."

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=658691

"I sometimes downvote things that seem mistaken. I think most users do."

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1006808

"If there's one thing I wish I could do to improve HN, it would be to detect this sort of middlebrow dismissal algorithmically.

. . . .

"The problem with the middlebrow dismissal is that it's a magnet for upvotes. The 'U R a fag's get downvoted and end up at the bottom of the page where they cause little trouble. But this sort of comment rises to the top. Things have now gotten to the stage where I flinch slightly as I click on the 'comments' link, bracing myself for the dismissive comment I know will be waiting for me at the top of the page."

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4693920

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#12
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Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is tokenadult related to the downvotes? I don't think so since someone with experience in HN will be more polite. I would to didcover the name of the downvoters.

People with experience in HN aren't always polite, please don't make such broad-sweeping and baseless assumptions.

How many of the downvotes are yours?

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#13
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Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because your comment is a logical fallacy -- a false dichotomy. You claim that the article portrays a search for single or few causes of intelligence/creativity, however the article doesn't argue that. The title -- "Study finds spatial skill is early sign of creativity" -- doesn't indicate that the only early sign of creativity is only measuring spatial skill, but instead it claims that a study's results demon…

You argued like a robot. I am commenting in HN not writing a paper on logic here. Look at the edges of what I said. Strangely I never had this extreme feedback from the HN community in my previous community participation. So, to me it seems that someone needs to go to run in the park for a while.

Please don't attack my methods of persuasion or pretend you know who I am, there's nothing wrong with arguing like a robot and my park attendance is none of your business.

Also, you didn't address my argument about how you're drawing conclusions that are irrelevant to the news article, but instead you made personal attacks against me. Stay classy.

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#14
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Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody said we should follow anything absolutely. This just points out that our current models are wrong and could benefit from some specific tweaks.

Absolutely in this context means that there are even smart people that follow this studies strictly.

ihsw is right. There is nothing "strict" about the study. It points out that we should add some spatial testing to all the other tests we have. That's a very moderate suggestion. There is nothing in the study or the article that says there is only one cause of intelligence or creativity, so I'm not sure why you mentioned it.

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#15
To emphasize the positive here, and to link to some other information about research on this topic, I invite readers to look at the freely downloadable peer-reviewed research articles from the Study of Mathematically Precocious Youth, which researches the issue of which early indicators of ability may be predictive of different kinds of adult achievement. The study has been looking at spatial ability tests as one of several kinds of ability tests for more than a decade.

https://my.vanderbilt.edu/smpy/publications/david-lubinski/

https://my.vanderbilt.edu/smpy/publications/camilla-benbow/

I know some of the study participants.

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#17
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Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now he is automatically downvoting everything I post here.

Is tokenadult related to the downvotes? I don't think so since someone with experience in HN will be more polite. I would to didcover the name of the downvoters.

In the interests of being polite, you are getting downvoted because you've made almost half the posts in a 15 comment thread, the bulk of which are complaints that your comments aren't better received.

The theme of the article is that research has revealed spatial reasoning plays a larger role in intelligence than we previously thought. Your post that you are sick and tired of people searching for the sole cause of intelligence is a hastily applied trope with little actual relevance.

Unfair or not, when people scroll down and see your posts in this thread many of them will feel compelled to downvote them as a way of telling you "please be more thoughtful with your comments". If you can't see why then maybe you are the one who needs to take a run in the park.

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#19
A similar conclusion struck me when I was taking a linear algebra course in my 1st year. I had a very smart friend, and sometimes I studied with him. He usually studied a lot more than myself, and naturally fared a lot better (and more consistently).

However there were some problems which were very unusual which I would look at, think for just a few seconds, and have a delightful path to the solution -- and often times, many. My friend, otoh, would usually look into the question, think for quite some time, and move on to the more straightforward ones, although with adequate time he would definitively solve it, and with adequate study, he would get consistent, as he did. But at once I discovered his whole process was fundamentally different. He found the solutions thinking algebraically, not geometrically. This algebraic skills allowed him to plow through most problems with speed, but when he needed to think creatively, to have a geometric intuition on something, he was slowed down.

He is a wonderful programmer however, and I'm sure he is "algotihmically creative".

For me this indicates that a lot of science lends itself a lot to have a spatial intuition to be effectively creative. Einstein famously came up with relativity through thought experiments, not algebraic reasoning of the laws of nature. Planck however, with equal notoriety introduced the quanta as an algebraic "trick", and Maxwell formulated an electromagnetic theory of light by manipulating differential equations. Computer science and a fraction of math, lend themselves to algebraic reasoning and I believe what drives those is an algebraic type of creativity, in contrast to say physics, architecture and mechanical engineering -- although I believe we need both types of thinkers everywhere.

It's a funny Yin and Yang aspect of our minds!

Re: Study Finds Spatial Skill Is Early Sign of Creativity

#20
It's possible that any test of intelligence that the educational system isn't measuring and working on is going to be a better predictor of various kinds of success than those it is. There are a huge number of factors in success, and it's possible that they are correlated more with each other than they are with the managing to get good scores on those few traits that are tested and taught for. (I don't know whether the original papers address this possibility; I'm just going by the linked article.)

Which isn't to say that it's bad to take these things at face value and start testing things like this as they're found to be relevant - it seems better to test and teach more things than fewer.

On a tangent, I seem to remember a study found that Quake improves spatial skills more than Tetris.

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