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Would you have survived in the middle ages?

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Re: Would you have survived in the middle ages?

#31

Post by HeyLaughingBoy »

gregwebs wrote: post #27
jacobolus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A person in the middle ages wouldn't be surrounded by a toxic environment Are you serious? You don't think living in a tiny room with 10 family members and all kinds of animals (along with all of the lice, fleas, diseases, etc. that go along), with a wood fire filling the whole place with eye-stinging, lung-choking smoke, was a "toxic environment"? You'd be eating mostly grains, with very occasionally some meat, an…

I guess the difference here is that you are assuming they are drinking excrement filled water, where I was thinking they are drinking fresh water. There is probably a large difference between those that began to live in more crowded cities and those that were still in more pristine country side. It is not clear cut whether people were smaller in the middle ages. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/medimen.htm Bathing…

I live in the USA on a small farm in an ordinary, modern house . Yesterday I removed two ticks from my body. In a few weeks, I'll be doing it daily, and checking my son for ticks at every change of clothing (he knows to kill the ones he finds, but he can't check his own back). We mostly have wood ticks, but there can be deer ticks along with them. Deer ticks carry Lyme Disease.

This is just a simple example of how bathing/changing clothes can affect your health. In the middle ages, you would have been walking in pathogen soup in all those dirty, sweat/urine/etc laden clothes you couldn't change out of.

Don't discount the impact of simple cleanliness. Pristine countryside? Doesn't exist. Go travel to one of those beautiful vistas you see in paintings, untouched by humanity and drink the clear stream water. Then spend the next few days doubled over in pain from all the parasites that live in the water, having arrived there from animal feces.

Re: Would you have survived in the middle ages?

#33

Post by jacobolus »

gregwebs wrote: post #27
jacobolus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A person in the middle ages wouldn't be surrounded by a toxic environment Are you serious? You don't think living in a tiny room with 10 family members and all kinds of animals (along with all of the lice, fleas, diseases, etc. that go along), with a wood fire filling the whole place with eye-stinging, lung-choking smoke, was a "toxic environment"? You'd be eating mostly grains, with very occasionally some meat, an…

I guess the difference here is that you are assuming they are drinking excrement filled water, where I was thinking they are drinking fresh water. There is probably a large difference between those that began to live in more crowded cities and those that were still in more pristine country side. It is not clear cut whether people were smaller in the middle ages. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/medimen.htm Bathing…

> fresh water ... pristine country side

Nah, in the middle ages you'll be drinking whatever water is in your village's stream or watering hole, and you'll be glad for it too, after you carry it half a mile on your back to your house. If that water gets contaminated with cholera, you'll blame the sickness on the wrath of an angry god, or perhaps a jealous neighbor who witched you.

> Bathing [...] is not that important for health.

What???

Re: Would you have survived in the middle ages?

#34

Post by gregwebs »

HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #31
gregwebs wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess the difference here is that you are assuming they are drinking excrement filled water, where I was thinking they are drinking fresh water. There is probably a large difference between those that began to live in more crowded cities and those that were still in more pristine country side. It is not clear cut whether people were smaller in the middle ages. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/medimen.htm Bathing…

I live in the USA on a small farm in an ordinary, modern house . Yesterday I removed two ticks from my body. In a few weeks, I'll be doing it daily, and checking my son for ticks at every change of clothing (he knows to kill the ones he finds, but he can't check his own back). We mostly have wood ticks, but there can be deer ticks along with them. Deer ticks carry Lyme Disease. This is just a simple example of how ba…

The odds of a healthy individual becoming ill from drinking water in pristine wilderness is actually extremely low. There is really no evidence for your assertion that you will automatically become ill from drinking unfiltered water once. My understanding is there is little risk if the water is not under upstream human or livestock use. http://www.wemjournal.org/wmsonline/?request=get-document&#3...

Re: Would you have survived in the middle ages?

#35

Post by jacobolus »

gregwebs wrote: post #34
HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in the USA on a small farm in an ordinary, modern house . Yesterday I removed two ticks from my body. In a few weeks, I'll be doing it daily, and checking my son for ticks at every change of clothing (he knows to kill the ones he finds, but he can't check his own back). We mostly have wood ticks, but there can be deer ticks along with them. Deer ticks carry Lyme Disease. This is just a simple example of how ba…

The odds of a healthy individual becoming ill from drinking water in pristine wilderness is actually extremely low. There is really no evidence for your assertion that you will automatically become ill from drinking unfiltered water once. My understanding is there is little risk if the water is not under upstream human or livestock use. http://www.wemjournal.org/wmsonline/?request=get-document&#3...

Very few people in the “middle ages” lived in pristine wilderness. The vast majority were, and always have been, rural peasants in feudal or semi-feudal societies, working as serfs or sharecroppers or slaves, either on tiny individual plots, or on plantations. They became ill constantly, and most children died before age 5. You seem to be imagining some kind of hunter-gatherer society.

Re: Would you have survived in the middle ages?

#36

Post by gregwebs »

jacobolus wrote: post #35
gregwebs wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The odds of a healthy individual becoming ill from drinking water in pristine wilderness is actually extremely low. There is really no evidence for your assertion that you will automatically become ill from drinking unfiltered water once. My understanding is there is little risk if the water is not under upstream human or livestock use. http://www.wemjournal.org/wmsonline/?request=get-document&#3...

Very few people in the “middle ages” lived in pristine wilderness. The vast majority were, and always have been, rural peasants in feudal or semi-feudal societies, working as serfs or sharecroppers or slaves, either on tiny individual plots, or on plantations. They became ill constantly, and most children died before age 5. You seem to be imagining some kind of hunter-gatherer society.

Hunter-gatherer-pastoral society- You are probably right. I would like to see some more scientific information on the subject if you have any.
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