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Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

defcon.org

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Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#71

Post by rdl »

david_shaw wrote: post #61
merlincorey wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure this is a joke since DT himself can be considered a fed, and there are lots of Defcon leadership that work with/for the feds as well.

I considered that. And yeah, DT is definitely a federal employee. I guess it depends on what you consider a 'fed.' Is a sysadmin at NASA a Fed? They are employed by the federal government... Law enforcement--especially intelligence--is not going to be particularly well received this year. In the years I've attended, it's always a friendly sort of cat and mouse game. "You're the Fed, I'm the hacker, let's get a beer!"…

The standard for "spot the fed" was "someone with federal arrest powers" -- even an NSA sysadmin wouldn't count.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#74

Post by nitrogen »

CyberDroiD wrote: post #55
btipling wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iamtherockstar you are hellbanned. Your comment appears as dead. I tell you because you made an informative comment. Looks like it happened about a month ago.

thanks for the info noob! quit bothering people.

I think I accidentally upvoted this comment when my phone's browser glitched. Meant to downvote.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#75

Post by mcantelon »

david_shaw wrote: post #49

This is going to be my tenth (?!) year at DEF CON. The culture of DEF CON, and especially its evolution, is a very interesting one. When I first attended DEF CON, it was a bunch of seemingly scary hackers. Fortunately, it turns out most of them were amazing people. As the conference grew (and changed venues several times), the culture began to evolve. The barrier to entry--in terms of being "accepted" into the subcul…

>many, though, actually do work for defense and intelligence contractors. Should they be banned because of their affiliation?

Absolutely. The hacker community should not contribute to the knowledge of those who work to undermine privacy and feed the surveillance-industrial complex.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#76

Post by anonymous »

dfc wrote: post #50
ENOTTY wrote: post #32

So I assume Dark Tangent won't attend his own con? Jeff Moss sits on the Homeland Security Advisory Board and is the CSO of ICANN.[1] If that's not "the man", I don't know what is. [1] http://www.dhs.gov/homeland-security-advisory-council-member...

I can understand your position with DHS. But CANN is hardly the man. Would you prefer a world where ICANN is unable to find competent security people because working for ICANN is some how associated with evil?

Supporting ICANN is hardly working in the name of "good".

Sure, working with ICANN may not be associated with "evil".

However to those in the know, it is associated with greed under the guise of "service to the public".

Personally, I'd prefer a world where ICANN, namely the centralization and commercialization of domain names to benefit a select few insiders and an array of parasitic sleazebags, gave way to a non-antagonistic naming system harmonized with trademark law and actually run transparently as a public service, for the public benefit.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#77

Post by mcantelon »

merlincorey wrote: post #57
david_shaw wrote: post #49

This is going to be my tenth (?!) year at DEF CON. The culture of DEF CON, and especially its evolution, is a very interesting one. When I first attended DEF CON, it was a bunch of seemingly scary hackers. Fortunately, it turns out most of them were amazing people. As the conference grew (and changed venues several times), the culture began to evolve. The barrier to entry--in terms of being "accepted" into the subcul…

I'm pretty sure this is a joke since DT himself can be considered a fed, and there are lots of Defcon leadership that work with/for the feds as well.

>this is a joke

More of a PR effort to salvage the brand than a joke, I'd guess.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#78

Post by mcantelon »

tippytop wrote: post #24
welder wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feds always attend in plain clothes so this effectively does nothing. I also wonder if a Fed only means investigative or law enforcement type Feds or also includes federally employed IT peoples.

I don't think the intention is to create a moat around the conference. Things have been getting quite cozy between these two [1]; I'm sure recent revelations don't play well with this conference's attendee base. [1] https://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9229756/NSA_chief_as...

A moat "this year" until it's safe for them, PR-wise, to work at legitimizing the feds again.

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#79

Post by res0nat0r »

mcantelon wrote: post #75
david_shaw wrote: post #49

This is going to be my tenth (?!) year at DEF CON. The culture of DEF CON, and especially its evolution, is a very interesting one. When I first attended DEF CON, it was a bunch of seemingly scary hackers. Fortunately, it turns out most of them were amazing people. As the conference grew (and changed venues several times), the culture began to evolve. The barrier to entry--in terms of being "accepted" into the subcul…

>many, though, actually do work for defense and intelligence contractors. Should they be banned because of their affiliation? Absolutely. The hacker community should not contribute to the knowledge of those who work to undermine privacy and feed the surveillance-industrial complex.

James Bamford pointed out in The Shadow Factory (back in 2008), that much of the "surveillance-industrial complex" is outsourced and that much of this bleeding edge tech is in fact coming from private companies (Narus, companies originating from Israel, etc). Should DEFCON setup a review board to ban employees from private companies they also don't agree with?

Re: Feds, We Need Some Time Apart

#80

Post by mcantelon »

throwawayDC21 wrote: post #29
codyb wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will this actually affect the feds ability to attend or will they just attend in plain clothes? Or will they be able to attend as feds and just be looked down upon?

There is nothing to mark them as feds, payments are in cash and everyone is in plain clothes. I think this will make very little difference to who attends. It is also worth mentioning that Black Hat (the two days preceding DEF CON) has reportedly seen a drop in registrations due to lack of funding for federal employees to attend (I have no source for this other than industry rumor). There was a suggestion that some w…

>everyone is welcome, regardless of background or ability

This year, in the spirit of inclusivity, they should bring in the lead architect of the Great Firewall of China.

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