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“Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

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Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#391

Post by throwit1979 »

mathattack wrote: post #182

"In January 2011, the Culosi family accepted a $2 million settlement offer from Fairfax County. That same year, Virginia’s government spent $20 million promoting the state lottery." Lotteries like this are a tax on people bad at math. How is this morally superior to an office pool? Though I do think viewing this as a "hit" enters the realm of tinfoil hats,

Lotteries like this are a tax on people bad at math

Most of the time, yes. Some lottery games with fixed odds and variable payouts have rare moments when the expected value of a ticket turns positive. I'm fairly good at math and I always play powerball every one or two years when this is the case.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#392

Post by unclebucknasty »

mikeash wrote: post #87
Ovid wrote: post #23

Is this really the America that America wants? The article mentions one case where a judge refused to issue a search warrant for a narcotics investigation and instead the police brought representatives from the Virginia Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control and raided the place with a swat team to conduct an alcohol inspection. What did they find? Two sample bottles of beer that weren't labeled as samples and a bo…

Sadly, yes, it is the America that America wants, as far as I can tell. I think this is where efforts to fight these problems fall down. They're almost all based on the assumption that the populace doesn't want this stuff to happen, but that the government pushes it through by abusing power, subverting democracy, etc. But from what I see, this is not the case. Most Americans want this. Whether it's gun-wielding mania…

But when do we stop to ask why we are living in this constant state of hyper-fear? When do we start asking whether the scale of our "security-state" is asymmetrical to the actual threats? When do we ask how much Terror is still left in the War on Terror?

IMO, it really started in earnest on 9/11. It's like people are in this strange state of psychological terror without realizing it. I swear, we've never recovered on the whole and it feels like something on the PTSD "spectrum".

Of course this fear has been fanned and used to justify an egregious power grab, costly wars, and untold billions in profits for the security-military-industrial complex, and so much more. See The Shock Doctrine by Naomi Klein.

Is it a coincidence that fear is so very profitable or that people are willing to give up their freedom to quell it?

When do we shake off this fear and say "enough!"?

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#393

Post by tsotha »

GeneralMayhem wrote: post #321
tsotha wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>True. Fallujah, being an example of SWAT team over-reaction On a nationstate level. That's so daft I don't know where to start. There's no such thing as an overreaction in war. >the more direct problem that there is no a preponderance of ex-soldiers, weapons, and an entire industrial base massively expanded and looking for civilian roles now everyone can see wars winding down and this kind of thing will be more prev…

>There's no such thing as an overreaction in war. There is when we (a) don't know who the enemies are and (b) live in a post-Geneva world where the international consensus is that yes, there are lines that can never be crossed.

a) We knew who the enemies were. We let civilians out of the city before it was attacked.

b) We didn't gas or nuke them. In terms of the amount of conventional firepower you can bring to bear on enemy combatants... there's no limit.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#394

Post by unclebucknasty »

kevinmchugh wrote: post #127
smky80 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do not "like" it. It's just that, to be very blunt, most people are basically peasants at heart. They're going to go along with whatever the king says. Twenty years ago, on that side of the line on a map, the people believed in capitalism, while on the other side the people believed in communism. On this side of the line people believed in this god, on that side, they believe in that god. It has nothing to do wi…

This is a somewhat ugly and self-aggrandizing view. It's easy to let people you don't know and will never meet become sub-human, but it's dangerous and harmful. The relevant xkcd is of course, http://xkcd.com/610/ . I don't presume to know why most people are not particularly vocal on these matters, but it's certainly not because they lack critical thought.

In a strange twist, I think one of the problems is that the more we celebrate the American ideal and elevate it above other nations, etc., the more difficult it becomes for people to mobilize for change, or even believe that change is necessary.

It's a strange groupthink that makes anything our government does the de facto morally superior action. It's an inherent trust by the masses that turn questioners into conspiracy theorists. The irony, of course, is that mentaility among the populace is perhaps the single most destructive threat to a true democracy, which demands vigilance.

And all of this is propped up by a corporate-political state that controls a media, which works tirelessly to maintain the image while also distracting us to no end with trivialities.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#395

Post by tsotha »

hvs wrote: post #379
tsotha wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also believe anything that makes them unhappy is a violation of their own rights.

This seems like more of a personal opinion of yours than anything based on fact.

It's what I've observed.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#397

Post by logn »

jaekwon wrote: post #209
Ovid wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with much of what you say, but I'm not sure I agree that "Americans won't accept that". - Obama has a secret "kill list" and has bragged about killing Americans without due process of law. - We have widespread surveillance of our phones and email. - The FBI admits that drones are now being used for domestic surveillance. - The activist Supreme Court is continuing to gut our laws and give Big Business everythi…

- Internet regulation justified by copyright protection - Continued unconstitutional wars again "terrorism" - Continued imperialism - Whistleblower vilification - Implicit taxation through unbridled govt debt On Facebook, some friends are even afraid to "like" these stories now. Most friends just ignore my posts. I can't tell whether they're apathetic, or whether they're suppressing it in fear. Or whether Facebook is…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_Search_for_Meaning

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#398

Post by dragontamer »

mmagin wrote: post #175
mikeash wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly, yes, it is the America that America wants, as far as I can tell. I think this is where efforts to fight these problems fall down. They're almost all based on the assumption that the populace doesn't want this stuff to happen, but that the government pushes it through by abusing power, subverting democracy, etc. But from what I see, this is not the case. Most Americans want this. Whether it's gun-wielding mania…

On a tangent (but hopefully quite relevant): Does anyone else feel that perhaps a lot of what we're seeing is a case of "Those who do not know history's mistakes are doomed to repeat them"? As I look back on all of the history education I received in school (the compulsory part, not college), it occurs to me that it was largely a lot of propaganda. With the exception of black slavery, a brief mention of WWII internme…

Here's what I learned in history class: * Civil Rights Movement * Jim Crow Laws * Trail of Tears * Vietnam War * LA Riots / Rodney King * Great Depression * Chicago Fire * WWII Internment Camps / War Propaganda * Bay of Pigs in Cuba * Other failed Coups in South America * Sherman's March to the Sea * "The Jungle" (disgusting food) * Child Labor * Growth of Monopolies * Haymarket massacre

What the were YOU doing in school? Mine was mostly a public education, so... plenty of "US mistakes" taught throughout US history from my perspective. Plenty of good and bad in history.

Middle School was mostly basic stuff, borderline propaganda from my memory. (But LA Riots were in fact covered in Middle School, perhaps because they were more "current events" rather than "history" at that point in time). But High School was filled with "TRUTH", in depth analysis and so forth. It was quite eye opening from my perspective. My High School US History class didn't cover "modern US History" however, and stopped in the late 50s. "Modern US History" was an elective at my high school... so my knowledge past the 50s becomes a bit incomplete.

The school cop even ensured a visit to many classes, to describe the rights of citizens in the state. Along the lines of: "In this state, you have the right to know a Cop's identity. If he refuses, take down the number on his car. Here's the police number where you can complain about this stuff". Very specific advice on how to cooperate, and if necessary, complain, about cops.

I know this was unusual and probably specific to the school cop who was assigned to my school. He was African American "and proud of it", to describe his attitude. (may have contributed to his emphasis on teaching citizens rights).

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#399

Post by dragontamer »

freetospeak wrote: post #336
lightcatcher wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm studying applied math at an almost exclusively STEM college. I've taken one history class (European history from 1300-1600) and will not be taking any others. However, I wouldn't consider my public history education to be "largely a lot of propaganda". I did take the advanced (AP) history courses at a public high school in Texas, and I might have just been lucky and great teachers, but my teachers discussed: -Bri…

One of your examples is about a private business. All but one of the others describe simply the brutality of colonization. It wouldn't be good propaganda if it looks 100% squeaky clean. Think about what meaningful questions are left unanswered. Why is it that any serious examination of the US' covert wars across the world is skipped entirely? Why is the entire era 1945-1991 painted in communist vs capitalist terms? T…

I learned about the covert wars in South America. I also learned about the establishment of Israel after WWII, and how US / Allied Forces were involved in that, the Palestinian perspective, the 6-day war and the establishment of Israel as a dominant military power.

The only major stuff I think I missed out on was the history of US involvement in Iran (of which I later learned in College history classes). But global covert actions (and not-so-covert: ie Vietnam War) during the Cold War era was definitely taught to me in general. High School History may have missed a few countries, but I hardly think it was propaganda from my perspective at least.

-----------------

The closest thing to "propaganda" I can think of was the Civil War saga frankly. Abraham Lincoln is considered an extreme hero up here in the North, who prevented our country from falling apart. Later in college, I learned that Southerners have a different perspective... even today. Extremely interesting to me.

Also, a friend of mine from Hawaii told me the Hawaiian perspective on the Annexation of Hawaii. Apparently... there is a bit of controversy on that subject in Hawaii that wasn't taught to me.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#400

Post by beedogs »

saraid216 wrote: post #319
darkarmani wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's rhetoric like this that makes cops feel obligated to protect each other from other citizens. Wait, what? If citizen's lied for each other in investigations, they'd be prosecuted.

> Wait, what? If citizen's lied for each other in investigations, they'd be prosecuted. What, the Internal Affairs division just doesn't exist? Does it not have enough power? Is that what's really being argued here? Or is this just feel-good we're-the-good-guys they're-the-bad-guys rhetoric intended to undermine what capabilities they have, cause them to feel threatened and insecure in the midst of the citizenry they…

::sniff sniff::

I smell bacon!

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