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“Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

salon.com

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Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#381

Post by comrade_ogilvy »

nhangen wrote: post #108
mikeash wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly, yes, it is the America that America wants, as far as I can tell. I think this is where efforts to fight these problems fall down. They're almost all based on the assumption that the populace doesn't want this stuff to happen, but that the government pushes it through by abusing power, subverting democracy, etc. But from what I see, this is not the case. Most Americans want this. Whether it's gun-wielding mania…

It's not that America wants this, it's that the politicians we elect do not keep their promises. Those that try are forced out, shaken down, relegated to stay at the bottom of the ladder. In our current political climate, a politician must barter ethics and morality for the power to do what they promised. And by then, it's too late, they're already gone.

That is a problem with the people who vote. We either will not vote for people who fail to over-promise, or fail to continue to support elected officials who make reasonable efforts to follow through, or both.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#382

Post by Loughla »

smky80 wrote: post #110
mikeash wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly, yes, it is the America that America wants, as far as I can tell. I think this is where efforts to fight these problems fall down. They're almost all based on the assumption that the populace doesn't want this stuff to happen, but that the government pushes it through by abusing power, subverting democracy, etc. But from what I see, this is not the case. Most Americans want this. Whether it's gun-wielding mania…

They do not "like" it. It's just that, to be very blunt, most people are basically peasants at heart. They're going to go along with whatever the king says. Twenty years ago, on that side of the line on a map, the people believed in capitalism, while on the other side the people believed in communism. On this side of the line people believed in this god, on that side, they believe in that god. It has nothing to do wi…

Fascinating - I've honestly never actually considered that.

How do you believe that social media and the like are playing into this long standing control of the media? What are the implications for the future (of both society and social media)?

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#383

Post by mynameishere »

sneak wrote: post #221
Nrsolis wrote: post #184

I knew Sal Culosi. He was a nice enough guy that used to hang out at Fast Eddies Sports Bar in Fairfax, VA. I saw him there often just tending a beer and minding his own business. If you can believe it, he was an optometrist at a Wal-Mart that just measured eyeballs and wrote prescriptions. If he was a bookie (as alleged) then I never saw anything that gave him away. I followed his story in the paper and was surprise…

It's shit like this that flies in the face of all those "but most cops are not bad guys" arguments. If an organization fights to protect bad guys, I don't care how much good they do: they are complicit in furthering criminal behavior. And they're in a position of trust, at that! It's an open secret that cops lie to protect other cops. Why do we allow this? Any other person in a special position of trust and responsib…

I agree with you except about UC Davis. I'm on a locked-down computer right now so I can't promise this is the correct vid, but if you see the unedited thing, those kids were 100% in the wrong:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#384

Post by dools »

rehack wrote: post #353
speeder wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Brazil not only people are usually like that (the "shocking" protests here, were still a minority... 1 million people in total, spread over the entire country, when the country has 200 million people... Compare that with european countries with a history of population fueled government changes, that regularly do protests with more than 1 million people and have less population), but people in Brazil are PROUD…

>In fact, here vote is mandatory, because when it wasn't, less than 5% voted at all But voting being mandatory, is a very alarming thing. Does not sound like democracy at all. What happens, when one does not vote?

Mandatory voting is essential for a healthy democracy.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#385

Post by DanBC »

dools wrote: post #384
rehack wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In fact, here vote is mandatory, because when it wasn't, less than 5% voted at all But voting being mandatory, is a very alarming thing. Does not sound like democracy at all. What happens, when one does not vote?

Mandatory voting is essential for a healthy democracy.

It's scary, because what do you do when 58% of the total electorate tick the "None of the above" option?

2001, 2005, and 2010 UK elections had less than 70% turn out. That's a scary 30% to 35% of people forced to tick a box.

I'm not sure having that many people randomly ticking a box is good for democracy, especially because it's probably not a random choice but determined things like position on the ballot paper.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#386

Post by TeMPOraL »

jeltz wrote: post #355
TeMPOraL wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the description of one of such "botched raids": "With an accidental weapon discharge, police fatally shot the 68-year-old retiree, who was not the target of the warrant. Police instructed Mr. Stamps to lie on the floor, and Mr. Stamps complied. One officer moved towards Mr. Stamps to check for weapons. The officer's tactical equipment made his movement awkward, and he lost his balance and fell. As he did so, his…

The "I tripped" explanation is used in many of the stories. Including when multiple bullets were fired. Either it is a lie or they are very careless.

Yes. Sort of like a dialogue from a random comic strip I heard about long ago:

- Why did you shoot the suspect?

- My finger twitched.

- Eight times?

On the more serious note, I still can't imagine that report in any other way that the person was either accidentally shot or executed. I mean, what kind of tripping you'd have to do to shoot a person on the ground in the chest? Geometry doesn't add up.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#387

Post by ajtaylor »

dschobel wrote: post #333
ajtaylor wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I now live very happily in Australia. It's not perfect by any means (nanny state comes to mind), but I feel safer here. More importantly, my wife feels safer.

The issue was never one of safety, the odds were never high that you would be on the receiving end of one of these SWAT attacks. The issue is the rights of citizens and their protection from unwarranted searches and unreasonable uses of force. Australia has it's own issues on that front, look up Labor's recent proposal of data retention for electronic records or the infamous great firewall of Australia. And as far as…

The safety issue is not about the government but the level of violence in general society, schools, etc. IMHO, Australia as a whole is a safer place to live than the US right now. You don't hear about people shooting up schools, etc in Australia because it doesn't happen. It feels to me that the rate of this type of incident in the US is increasing.

As I said, Australia isn't perfect by far. But at least the government isn't ignoring its core, founding principles like the US government has been doing the last couple decades.

I did mention nanny state in my original comment. To each their own. :)

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#388

Post by babby »

VladRussian2 wrote: post #280
JulianMorrison wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also don't be black, poor, trans, or a sex worker (and if you're black, poor and trans, you'd better dress like a nun, or the police will read you as a sex worker). People in those categories usually don't even make it as far as an outraged Salon article.

yep, as they say - being black is a probable cause.

And lets not pretend that it isn't a stereotype without warrant. Not going to go into the racial factors, more the cultural. It's just simply more likely that blacks will be criminals in certain areas - humans have evolved to generalize things like this for survival's sake.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#390

Post by babby »

Spooky23 wrote: post #287

End of the day, swat teams exist because the guys on the department like cool toys, and the Feds pay for them via grant programs. My local police department has a "command center" rv and telescopic lookout post that the Feds paid like $3M for. The machine guns are usually bought with seized drug money, and tactical training paid for try the Feds. Most cities don't need paramilitary squads, so they end up using them f…

I think a point you may not be considering is that the reason why they use these paramilitary squads for stupid shit is not just to have fun, but instead to justify the purchase of all of this gear and training in the first place. If you never use the stuff then it stands to reason that it may not make the budget in the future (assuming budgeting competence).
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