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“Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

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Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#361

Post by Shivetya »

phaus wrote: post #269
sneak wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's shit like this that flies in the face of all those "but most cops are not bad guys" arguments. If an organization fights to protect bad guys, I don't care how much good they do: they are complicit in furthering criminal behavior. And they're in a position of trust, at that! It's an open secret that cops lie to protect other cops. Why do we allow this? Any other person in a special position of trust and responsib…

>Any other person in a special position of trust and responsibility that contravenes their duty gets _extra_punishment. I completely agree, whenever politicians, CEOs of megacorporations, field-grade military officers and senior noncommissioned officers, local government officials, district attorneys, and intelligence agents break the law, the punishment is ALWAYS extremely severe isn't it? I mean, it must really suc…

Eliot Spizter is a grand example of this. Prosecuted mercilessly the very type of crime that brought him down, of which he escaped essentially unpunished for because he had the means to evade it.

Your average cop and his buddies are of course going to look out for each other, they are usually the ones under the bus when the higher ups go on a witch hunt

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#362

Post by saraid216 »

darkarmani wrote: post #349
saraid216 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wait, what? If citizen's lied for each other in investigations, they'd be prosecuted. What, the Internal Affairs division just doesn't exist? Does it not have enough power? Is that what's really being argued here? Or is this just feel-good we're-the-good-guys they're-the-bad-guys rhetoric intended to undermine what capabilities they have, cause them to feel threatened and insecure in the midst of the citizenry they…

> cause them to feel threatened and insecure in the midst of the citizenry they're supposed to be protecting, and motivating them to develop a similar and responsive antagonistic attitude Are we still railing against rhetoric? The argument isn't they started it, it's "they have been granted tremendous power, so they need to accept accountability."

> The argument isn't they started it, it's "they have been granted tremendous power, so they need to accept accountability."

Yes. "Fuck the police" really captures that argument well.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#363

Post by saraid216 »

adventured wrote: post #331
saraid216 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wait, what? If citizen's lied for each other in investigations, they'd be prosecuted. What, the Internal Affairs division just doesn't exist? Does it not have enough power? Is that what's really being argued here? Or is this just feel-good we're-the-good-guys they're-the-bad-guys rhetoric intended to undermine what capabilities they have, cause them to feel threatened and insecure in the midst of the citizenry they…

Maybe you should avoid letting your temper get the best of you with such emotional outbursts as: "fuck people like sneak," on Hacker News. If you can't control your temper, why are you even participating in the discussion here? Personal attacks like that aren't acceptable here, and I'd think you would know that by now after three plus years. It's disgusting to see that level of discourse here.

Using a personal attack to rebuke an alleged personal attack is not what I'd call a convincing argument.

> If you can't control your temper, why are you even participating in the discussion here?

Because http://xkcd.com/386/ Stop being wrong and I'll go away.

Seriously, if you want to whine about the level of discourse, then you're welcome to start with the person I originally responded to. But you won't, will you? Because you agree with him, so his emotional outburst is okay.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#364

Post by saraid216 »

jlgreco wrote: post #330
saraid216 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wait, what? If citizen's lied for each other in investigations, they'd be prosecuted. What, the Internal Affairs division just doesn't exist? Does it not have enough power? Is that what's really being argued here? Or is this just feel-good we're-the-good-guys they're-the-bad-guys rhetoric intended to undermine what capabilities they have, cause them to feel threatened and insecure in the midst of the citizenry they…

> What, the Internal Affairs division just doesn't exist? In fact yes. Many police departments do not have "Internal Affairs". Where they nominally exist, they are rarely staffed by a separate group of people, rather "internal affairs" work is handled by the same people as everything else. The same people behind the same silent blue wall... Hollywood depictions of "Internal Affairs" are largely a "Hollywood thing".

I can support a campaign to increase staffing for more of such divisions so that they're independent and capable of successfully prosecuting cops who lie to protect cops.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#365

Post by steveklabnik »

lizzard wrote: post #351
eranation wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was trying to find out more about this case and was surprised not to find any direct Wikipedia mention for it, after digging a little bit, I found out that this case was removed from Wikipedia entry 'List of cases of police brutality' about 3 weeks ago, under the comment "no evidence that this belongs as a brutality case" http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_cases_of_p... Although I don't know anything…

If there is a list of cases of police shootings, add it to that!

http://copsshootingpeople.wordpress.com/ was going for a while, seems dormant.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#366

Post by njharman »

yogo wrote: post #225
sneak wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's shit like this that flies in the face of all those "but most cops are not bad guys" arguments. If an organization fights to protect bad guys, I don't care how much good they do: they are complicit in furthering criminal behavior. And they're in a position of trust, at that! It's an open secret that cops lie to protect other cops. Why do we allow this? Any other person in a special position of trust and responsib…

These things are still pretty rare. Unfortunately, once you start raiding barber shops and pool halls with so much heat something like this is bound to happen. I still find it to be an honorable job with honest guys that put their lives on the line; however, statistically there's always going to be some hot-headed trigger-happy guy involved. Plus even if they're not on the force they're in some neighborhood as the un…

> These things are still pretty rare.

Prove that. You can't, cause it's a negative. It seems much, much more likely that "The times these things are uncovered and get national press attention is rare." For the few times that are, how many are not, 10x? 100x? I can't know, but I 100% doubt we catch 100% of these things.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#367

Post by oftenwrong »

merraksh wrote: post #234

But the Occupiers, who tended to be young, white, and middle-to upper-middle-class, knew social media like few other demographics. They knew how to live-stream video directly to the Internet. They all had smart phones, so police couldn’t suppress incriminating video by confiscating one or two or ten phones—someone was bound to have video of not only the original incident but also of police trying to confiscate phones…

The US police have already learned! I have already seen articles about cell service being suspended to stifle protests.

For example:

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/08/barts-cell-phone-shutd...

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#368

Post by mrt0mat0 »

I know this doesn't necessarily belong in THIS article, but it's a general response to a lot of these governmental articles. Where are the debates at in the government? I never see debates taking place in Congress. I hear speeches and "thank yous" and even opinions, but no true debate. I know that I tune in to watch the presidential debates because even though they aren't always held accountable for what they say, there is the opportunity to be. I wish we had more debates like i see in these comments.

Re: “Why did you shoot me? I was reading a book”

#370

Post by njharman »

dasil003 wrote: post #214
ryanSrich wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, "like" is a subjective term but for the most part people support it. I hear all the time..."It's for the better. It allows the government to keep track of the bad guys and if I have to be inconvenienced a few times out of the year that I travel than so be it." Or..."All I use email for is work and talking with family. If they want to read that stuff they can, I have nothing to hide. If it helps keep me safe the…

I think it's sad how a default distrust of the government gets one painted as a crazy gun-toting militiaman, or a tinfoil hat conspiracy theorist. These are after all, the people who founded America, not out of paranoia, but from deep reflection on the nature and history of government.

Default distrust everyone is one thing. But when you single out government (as if the "government" where a thing and not just comprised of people) and not recognizing government is a symptom of more fundamental causes that I'm gonna "default distrust you as a crazy at best, or ignorant at worst".
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