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Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

airliners.net

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Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#151

Is this a case for or against automatic airplane control?

Free flight was supposed to have happened already. But there are obstacles.

As for ATCs if you do not make use of a skill frequently, you atrophy. When you are suddenly thrown in the middle of an emergency, you perform badly. We can't have "mall cops" watching computers doing air traffic control.

People do not like automation that much either. Consider the fact that underground trains have drivers even though technically they are not needed.

And then there are the technical aspects...

So I do not think that this particular crash would bring much new to the table.

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#152
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazing changes in information [1] flow. HN becomes a better source than all major networks combined. [1] Information as contrasted to conjecture and dramatization.

I've had CNN on for a while and it's amazing how little information they are giving. Until I came here i didn't know if there were 2 dead or 200 dead. It's almost as if they are so concerned with being wrong about anything that they can't offer any sort of initial report, rumor, or conjecture.

Almost as they they're trying to report rather than spread "rumor, or conjecture"? If that's the case they deserve applause; it'd be nice to see news agencies back on the reporting track, analysing and filtering before going on-air.

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#153
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine the confusion that must have gone on when that happened, maybe it's shock or maybe people just underestimate the severity of their situation but correct me if I'm wrong... are there people in that photo actually carrying their bags off the plane? I can't quite comprehend that.

The bottlenecks in their escape were the doorway and the crew's deployment of the inflatable slide. Rushing the door in a panic would have done nobody any good. In a situation like that, why wouldn't you grab your bag if it was readily accessible? It seems like healthy, rational behavior rather than a symptom of extreme confusion.

A lot of plane crash deaths happen after the crash - burning fuel can spread quickly and kill or incapacitate people inside. Every second counts. Even if you already have your bag in hand, you're leaving less room for others in the aisle.

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#154
Sheryl Sandberg was scheduled to be on this flight but switched to a United flight [1]

The now famous photo from the ground is by David Eun, a Samsung Executive [2]. Coincidentally at a time when there are talks of a Samsung / Facebook partnership [3]

[1] https://www.facebook.com/sheryl/posts/10152997724435177 [2] http://www.linkedin.com/in/davideun1 [2] http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-facebook...

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#155
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine the confusion that must have gone on when that happened, maybe it's shock or maybe people just underestimate the severity of their situation but correct me if I'm wrong... are there people in that photo actually carrying their bags off the plane? I can't quite comprehend that.

The bottlenecks in their escape were the doorway and the crew's deployment of the inflatable slide. Rushing the door in a panic would have done nobody any good. In a situation like that, why wouldn't you grab your bag if it was readily accessible? It seems like healthy, rational behavior rather than a symptom of extreme confusion.

  The bottlenecks in their escape were the doorway and the 
  crew's deployment of the inflatable slide... why wouldn't 
  you grab your bag if it was readily accessible?
Wrong. In order to be certified airworthy, you have to be able to evacuate an airliner in 90 seconds, in the dark, with some of the emergency exits blocked. Here's an A380 doing it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY

Here's a 777: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY

If everyone stops to grab their bag, it can take ten times as long. If the plane is on fire, then people die.

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#156
While we are looking at reasons why this crash happened it may be worthwhile to consider Malcolm Gladwell's suggestion in his book 'Outliers' that Korean cultural legacy, where the High Power Distance ratio between bosses (the pilot) and their underlings (such as the co-pilot) were responsible for a series of Korean Air crashes in the 1990s.

"In addition to weather and pilot fatigue, he blames those crashes on crew members whose cultural legacy made them too deferential to communicate clearly that the plane was about to crash"

http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2008/12/04/malcolm-gladwell-...

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#157
post #62
post #29

High quality close up photo from https://path.com/p/1lwrZb : https://pathakacdn-a.akamaihd.net/photos2/f36a5729-6db7-40db...

I can't imagine the confusion that must have gone on when that happened, maybe it's shock or maybe people just underestimate the severity of their situation but correct me if I'm wrong... are there people in that photo actually carrying their bags off the plane? I can't quite comprehend that.

""" The majority of passengers who replied to the Safety Board’s questionnaire were carrying at least one piece of carry-on luggage. Only 25 passengers (6 percent) reported having no bags with them in the cabin. Of the 419 passengers who reported that they carried on bags, 208 (nearly 50 percent) reported attempting to remove a bag during their evacuation. The primary reason that passengers stated for grabbing their bags was for money, wallet, or credit cards (111 passengers). Other reasons included job items (65), keys (61), and medicines (51). Most passengers exited the airplane with their bags.

Passengers exiting with carry-on baggage were the most frequently cited obstruction to evacuation. Twenty-four of the 36 flight attendants who responded listed carry-on baggage as an obstruction. Overall, 37 percent of the passengers indicated that retrieving carry-on baggage slowed the evacuation; however, in five of the evacuations (cases 9, 16, 24, 27, and 32), a majority of passengers believed that the evacuation was slowed by carry-on baggage. Further, 70 passengers and 8 flight attendants reported arguments between passengers and flight attendants regarding luggage.

[...] The Safety Board concludes that passengers’ efforts to evacuate an airplane with their carry-on baggage continue to pose a problem for flight attendants and are a serious risk to a successful evacuation of an airplane. """

http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/safetystudies/SS0001.pdf (page 66-68)

Re: Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO

#158
post #134

I know this is exciting news and all, but: http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Hacker News Guidelines What to Submit On-Topic: Anything that good hackers would find interesting. That includes more than hacking and startups. If you had to reduce it to a sentence, the answer might be: anything that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity. Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're…

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