Poll: What is your highest educational qualification? • Hacker News Board

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#131

Post by brent » Thu, May 07, 2009, 12:40 AM UTC

10ren wrote: post #122

brent wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't recall Larry learning anything from doing a PhD itself, as opposed to doing the work independently." Seeing as one major focus of a PhD is to learn to do independent research, this statement is essentially vacuous. It also disregards the influence on his thinking process from his advisor (Winograd) and fellow graduate students.

You missed "great people around him". The distinction is not essentially vacuous: it's possible for the learning of "how to do independent research" to be itself largely independent, e.g. Edison and Einstein. I said I don't recall Larry talking about this anywhere - can you show where he does? Specifically, about how doing the PhD helped this specific person to learn to do independent research. I'm interested in this…

I did not miss "great people around him". Your claim was that he didn't learn anything from his PhD. My claim is that he undoubtedly learned a lot from his advisor and other graduate students. If you are talking about learning stuff in classes, that is simply not the point of a PhD. Anywhere you see him credit Winograd's influence, you are seeing him mention learning from his PhD. See his commencement speech from like 3-4 days ago as one recent reference...

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#132

Post by qeorge » Thu, May 07, 2009, 12:49 AM UTC

Finished high school, attended 4 years of college, dropped out as a senior.

Might finish one day, just because I don't like having things unfinished.

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#133

Post by 10ren » Thu, May 07, 2009, 1:05 AM UTC

brent wrote: post #131

10ren wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You missed "great people around him". The distinction is not essentially vacuous: it's possible for the learning of "how to do independent research" to be itself largely independent, e.g. Edison and Einstein. I said I don't recall Larry talking about this anywhere - can you show where he does? Specifically, about how doing the PhD helped this specific person to learn to do independent research. I'm interested in this…

I did not miss "great people around him". Your claim was that he didn't learn anything from his PhD. My claim is that he undoubtedly learned a lot from his advisor and other graduate students. If you are talking about learning stuff in classes, that is simply not the point of a PhD. Anywhere you see him credit Winograd's influence, you are seeing him mention learning from his PhD. See his commencement speech from lik…

Soon after, I told my advisor, Terry Winograd, it would take a couple of weeks to download the web -- he nodded knowingly, fully aware it would take much longer but wise enough to not tell me.

Maybe a nod is encouragement, but it sounds like Larry had decided to do it anyway - so the statement reads as an absence of discouragement.

On reflection, I think we mean the same thing, your "learned a lot from his advisor and other graduate students", and my "great people around him". There's a question of what a PhD is. It could be the independent work; the academic justification and presentation in terms of literature; the discussions with smart, interested people. (btw I've been doing one for a few years now).

I think our disagreement is about our definitions.

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#134

Post by cvboss » Thu, May 07, 2009, 1:31 AM UTC

GeneralMaximus wrote: post #59

tjr wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a bachelor's degree in computer science. I probably learned some topics better than I would have on my own, thanks to being forced to dig deeper for the class. But I was an avid self-studier of computer science, and I learned a whole lot on my own. For the amount of computer science knowledge I need to do my real world work so far, I'm not convinced getting the formal education made a noticeable difference. Th…

Sounds like you went to a great school. Most colleges in India don't allow any flexibility in what courses you can take. You have to pass all the prescribes subjects. Liberal arts? That's unheard of back here.

Mate, "liberal arts" is not a subject, trust me, you do have liberal arts in India :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_arts

edit:link added

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#135

Post by nphase » Thu, May 07, 2009, 5:21 AM UTC

College Dropout, and fairly satisfied with my results. YMMV

Re: Poll: What is your highest educational qualification?

#136

Post by tokenadult » Thu, May 07, 2009, 5:56 PM UTC

raffi wrote: post #127

cduan wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A J.D. is considered a terminal degree (there is no further degree beyond a J.D.; the S.J.D. is considered a different track), so technically you do have a doctorate. But ethical rules are questionable as to whether you can call yourself a "doctor," because it's potentially misleading. So US lawyers are in the strange position of having doctorates, but being unable to say so. Here's some more info: http://abajournal.…

Don't lawyers (i.e. our friends with the J.D.) get to refer to themselves as esquire? i.e. Bob Jones, esq or something like that.

I think that is the conventional use of the term "esquire" in the United States, but I can't recall the last time when I saw a lawyer use that title. Most lawyers like best the title "attorney at law," which is the title for the regulated occupation they enjoy once they have passed a state bar examination.