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Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

samharris.org

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Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#31

Post by makeset »

beachstartup wrote: post #3
makeset wrote: post #2

I'd never mess with mind-altering drugs. You don't tweak a Ferrari. EDIT: Guys, relax. It was a joke. You think anyone goes and calls their own mind a Ferrari seriously? Jeez.

worst analogy ever, especially for a post that so thinly veils your misguided feelings of superiority. ferraris were meant to be tweaked, what do you think the entire field of motorsport exists for? from F1 all the way down to the local DE event at the local track, cars are tweaked endlessly, with passion. you won't find any shortage of tweaked exotics at your local autocross, either. if nobody "twaeked" cars, you wo…

You don't have much of a sense of humor, do you.

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#34

Post by TausAmmer »

tbirdz wrote: post #13
Nursie wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by mind altering drugs? Do you never touch beer? Coffee? What makes you so sure that the drugs you favour are safe for your mind and that others are not?

Personally I do avoid illegal drugs, and many legal ones such as alcohol, tobacco, caffeine, etc. so I don't think it is really fair to assume hypocrisy on makeset's part here. That being said, I did find their comment to come off a bit arrogant, and dismissive. If you do choose to live a lifestyle where you do not use these substances, like I and many others do, that is okay. But it's not okay to try and push this v…

Events took for the worse, by introducing alcohol as the new "norm", we accepted "norm" as something horrible.

Then We put nam "drugs" as something way way worse than alcohol.

You don't need to use any of these, but this is the perfectly engineered view.

You can see this pattern in human behaviour, easily manipulative behaviour. Shopping culture, money spending, corporations, laws, this is like big fractal blooming same thing.

Still, it is interesting, seeing it all expressed and experiencing it, ever changing.

Have a nice day!

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#35

Post by _yosefk »

"Everything we do is for the purpose of altering consciousness. We form friendships so that we can feel certain emotions, like love, and avoid others, like loneliness. We eat specific foods to enjoy their fleeting presence on our tongues."

We study and work for the purpose of altering the bits representing our bank account balances. Is that equivalent to hacking the bank and altering the bits directly?

We make friendships "to feel emotions like love". To what degree is it sane to misrepresent yourself and otherwise deceive people to make them your "friends"?

There's a contest for the shortest program printing itself to the screen. Is opening the file with the source code and copying the code to the screen really as good an entry as any other?

Any sane person and even most varieties of the insane person realize that the signal you're receiving is a means to infer that something is happening out there, not an end in itself.

This is not to say that there should or should not be a War on Drugs (which, since I'm not an American citizen, is really none of my business.)

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#36

Post by lolcraft »

cristianpascu wrote: post #11

"Everything we do is for the purpose of altering consciousness." I very much respect Sam Harris for taking the consciousness problem seriously. It poses a real problem to (his) atheism, and he, obviously, rejects the substance dualism, which would logically lead to a religious view on us. However, without a conscious soul, meaning itself loses meaning. What's the ontological support for meaning to rise on? One thing…

Look, if you think rejecting dualism is "not taking the consciousness problem seriously", you should read more.

And well, one thing that Christianism seems to be still struggling to learn is that, beyond reproductible and well defined experiments, and falsifiable hypotheses, nothing can really be more than logical inference from some axioms. Maybe some dudes up in the Vatican implicitly defined some axioms about what's "really a mystical experience", probably marginalizing the Orthodox and Gnostics and Cathars while they were at it. I don't personally care.

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#37

Post by Nursie »

[deleted] wrote: post #32
glhaynes wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go on… actually make your case…

[deleted]

So you can't decide you want to have a go because intellectuals that inspire you had good things to say about it?

That's not a valid choice in your opinion?

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#38

Post by TausAmmer »

[deleted] wrote: post #32
glhaynes wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go on… actually make your case…

[deleted]

Can't stress this enough, I went years researching and getting rid of my demons before engulfing in these experiences.

Of course, jumping the gun can be something very very amazing.

But sometimes, little preperation would not hurt.

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#39

Post by md224 »

cristianpascu wrote: post #11

"Everything we do is for the purpose of altering consciousness." I very much respect Sam Harris for taking the consciousness problem seriously. It poses a real problem to (his) atheism, and he, obviously, rejects the substance dualism, which would logically lead to a religious view on us. However, without a conscious soul, meaning itself loses meaning. What's the ontological support for meaning to rise on? One thing…

> However, without a conscious soul, meaning itself loses meaning. What's the ontological support for meaning to rise on?

I sort of understand what you mean here, but at the same time I don't. Are you specifically referring to intrinsic meaning, as opposed to socially-constructed meaning?

As an agnostic that rejects supernatural explanations, I don't feel a conflict between the ability of human beings to ascribe meaning to things and the possibility that the "soul" (in the sense of a magically indivisible entity of self) does not exist.

Re: Drugs and the Meaning of Life (2011)

#40

Post by josscrowcroft »

Reading other comments here: don't get hung up on his opening gambit: "Everything we do is for the purpose of altering consciousness.". That's just an introductory point.

I recommend reading the whole article, which is a beautiful balance of science and spirit, while being totally upfront and honest about the risks involved, even to the spiritually 'serious'.

As for me - psychedelics changed everything, but I stayed the same (or maybe everything stayed the same, but sad parts of me continue to be stripped away).

They continue to burn what is not real, as long as the heart is directed squarely at Truth and the mind is kept sharp and open. The trend is towards greater compassion, deeper love and surrender, coming more fully into the wholeness of being!

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