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Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

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Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#21

Post by coldtea »

"Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs"

Might as well have written: "Memories of segregation and lynching color African American's view of modern day bigots".

I mean the "color" part tries to make it as something strange (or even bad, some kind of "distortion") is happening, when it's the most natural thing in the world: actual historical experience with the issue, makes German's more informed on what it can result to and more sensitive to how bad it is.

I'm always amazed to what BS spin columnists put on their stories. And not always innocently.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#22

Post by grannyg00se »

coldtea wrote: post #21

"Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs" Might as well have written: "Memories of segregation and lynching color African American's view of modern day bigots". I mean the "color" part tries to make it as something strange (or even bad, some kind of "distortion") is happening, when it's the most natural thing in the world: actual historical experience with the issue, makes German's more in…

But this guy was a colonel in the Stasi.

If a similar interview with someone who did participate in lynchings were conducted, I don't think your second title would be all that far off. But racial bigotry isn't the hot issue right now. I think it's helpful to draw parallels to the past - and a title like that might help encourage people to actually read.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#23

Post by lispm »

The US is in need for a full operating system upgrade. Like going from Mac OS 9 to OS X. Not a .1 upgrade. Obama delivered a Microsoft-style upgrade. You were promised 'hope' and 'change'. What you got is a worse version of Microsoft Windows with lots of spyware and a built-in 'security' system.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#24

Post by lispm »

feral wrote: post #20

The EU, which Germany is a major part of, passed the Data Retention Directive [0] in 2006. That directive required every state in the EU to pass laws that all their citizens telecommunications metadata would be stored for at least 6 months, and often more, up to 2 years. As I understand it, this means all 'metadata' is required to be stored, including the source and destination for every phonecall and text message, i…

The German 'Verfassungsgericht' has said in 2010 that it is unconstitutional.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#25

Post by blumentopf »

feral wrote: post #20

The EU, which Germany is a major part of, passed the Data Retention Directive [0] in 2006. That directive required every state in the EU to pass laws that all their citizens telecommunications metadata would be stored for at least 6 months, and often more, up to 2 years. As I understand it, this means all 'metadata' is required to be stored, including the source and destination for every phonecall and text message, i…

In Germany, the data retention law was ruled unconstitutional by the German Constitutional Court on March 2, 2010. Data retention was allowed in general by the court, but only with significant restrictions. The German government failed to pass a new law which fulfills both the EU data retention directive and the court's restrictions. The EU Commission therefore is currently sueing Germany to implement the EU data retention directive. If the EU Commission prevails, Germany will have to pay 315.036,54 Euro per day as a penalty fee until a proper law is enacted.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#26

Post by philipp-de »

walshemj wrote: post #17
hiddenfeatures wrote: post #6

In my experience over the last few weeks, younger Germans (my age, 30 years & younger) are blissfully ignorant ("I don't have anything to hide" - sounds familiar ?) to the impact of the government spying on its citizen. 24 years are a long time & that part of history is not as well-ingrained in the collective memory as the Holocaust. :-(

Its always struck me as odd that Germans seem to be so hot on privacy but seem fine with having mandatory ID cards and with the police being able to demand you show it.

germans generally like order very, very much. :)

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#28

Post by dwaltrip »

lispm wrote: post #23

The US is in need for a full operating system upgrade. Like going from Mac OS 9 to OS X. Not a .1 upgrade. Obama delivered a Microsoft-style upgrade. You were promised 'hope' and 'change'. What you got is a worse version of Microsoft Windows with lots of spyware and a built-in 'security' system.

We need to re-write the damn kernel

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#29

Post by philipp-de »

feral wrote: post #20

The EU, which Germany is a major part of, passed the Data Retention Directive [0] in 2006. That directive required every state in the EU to pass laws that all their citizens telecommunications metadata would be stored for at least 6 months, and often more, up to 2 years. As I understand it, this means all 'metadata' is required to be stored, including the source and destination for every phonecall and text message, i…

There's more. There's technical standards, procedures and laws accross europe for the storage, retrieval and processing of metadata and other information.

it's called ETSI Lawful Interception see: * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawful_interception#Technical_d...

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawful_interception#Europe

* http://www.etsi.org/index.php/technologies-clusters/technolo...

* http://webapp.etsi.org/WorkProgram/Report_WorkItem.asp?WKI_I...

* http://webapp.etsi.org/WorkProgram/Report_WorkItem.asp?WKI_I...

This has been in place much longer than the "data retention" directive.

Re: Memories of Stasi color Germans’ view of U.S. surveillance programs

#30

Post by at-fates-hands »

oceanstone wrote: post #8

Assuming this level of unconstitutional surveillance continues, what can we do? Here are some of my ideas: Send encrypted emails, to communicate long distances. Use the internet way less. Use cell phones only to arrange real life meetups. Hang out & talk to people in real life. Never have a meaningful discussion "over the air".

This actually made me think about what kinds of analog communication equipment could we use and encrypt transmissions with? I know Motorola makes some two way radios that have encryption, just not sure how good it is.

It would be interesting if people started to revert back to less and less digital communication and went back to doing what you're talking about. It's almost like another counter revolution taking shape.

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