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Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

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Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#141
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This page says it's disabled by software - not by hardware. So it really depends on how much you trust the software and the people making it. The software is closed source and the people making it also happened to be the first ones to sign onto PRISM.

The aftermarket part to disable the Kinect without breaking warranty is not very expensive: http://www.amazon.com/Post--3-Inches-Canary-Yellow-12-Pads/d... Though there are a number of reasons I don't like the Xbox One, the Kinect isn't one of them.

You could very well do that. You could also crack open the kinect as soon as you buy it and change it so you can disable it by a switch or something like that. Although permanent disconnection apparently isn't a good idea as saying "xbox on" will I hear be the only way you turn the device on.

Really though I think it'd be easier for them to just give customers the option not to plug it in, but my guess is that they're trying to make sure everyone uses the kinect that they ship with the console (its not necessarily being used for nefarious purposes), but with that being said I still don't trust Microsoft.

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#143
post #7

I'm pretty sure short-sighted consumers/gamers shot themselves in the foot on this one, big time. I would have liked to have seen if Microsoft's move would have led to cheaper per game pricing like we see on PC. I guess we'll never know. I actually respected them for making a ballsy change like this that may have brought the console gaming industry into the Steam era. Also, it now looks like you can no longer share/l…

While you might be right in part, Microsoft still shot themselves in the foot with this one.

Some parts of the original plan were actually a good idea, if you think of the Xbox One as being purely for digital downloads. It's very similar to Steam, but with a few differences. Better in some respects (shared library, which Valve are reportedly considering), worse in others (can't work offline).

The problem is that they were applying the exact same system to physical copies of a game. While their original plan was actually pretty good for digital distribution (it's a little more permissive than the Xbox 360), it's awful for physical copies. The physical copy is nothing more than a CD key and a backup so you don't have to download the game. It completely violates everyone's expectations of what a physical copy is, and what you can do with it.

Microsoft explained all this very poorly. Their message was basically "here's all the ways we're going to restrict Xbox One games, all the extra requirements to play Xbox One games, and all the things you used to be able to do that you can't anymore". The benefits were an afterthought, barely mentioned, and they waited until E3 to even do that.

What they probably should have done is separate physical and digital copies. Have digital copies work more or less the same as the original announcement, and physical copies work like they do on the Xbox 360. Then it becomes a choice. If you want all the benefits of digital distribution (and make sure you play those benefits up at every opportunity), you can do that. If you don't, get a physical copy, and it works the same way it always has.

Although Microsoft do clearly want to move towards only digital distribution, they can't yet. The restrictions on physical copies are basically just a response to publishers, who are convinced that the used game market is the cause of all of their problems. They're wrong, of course. Just as they were wrong about piracy being the cause of all their problems, and just as they were wrong about game rentals being the cause of all their problems before that.

As for the pricing thing - that will not happen.

As far as publishers are concerned, US$60 for a game is a bargain. They'd love to charge more, but people won't pay more than that. There is no way they'd ever reduce that, even if they eliminated used games entirely, and had zero distribution and publishing costs. They've already established that people are willing to pay US$60 for a game, and the sale price of an item is simply whatever people are willing to pay for it. If they reduce costs, why would they reduce the asking price? If they increase sales by removing used games entirely, why could they reduce the price? That's not how businesses work.

The only way game prices will come down is if there's some kind of competition. Game publishers will charge the same for an Xbox One or PS4 version of a game, because the publishers control the prices, so there's no competition there. New games currently cost the same on Xbox 360, PS3, and Steam, after all. Retailers don't really have much scope for reducing prices, because they have very little margin on new games, so there's no competition there. Used games would no longer be competing either, because publishers would just ask for some (probably very high) cut of all used game sales. There's no way to set up a competing online shop for Xbox One games, and no way to publish an Xbox One game without going through Microsoft, so there's no chance of competition there either.

The only potential source of competition is between games. Publishers have demonstrated that they are not willing to do this. Not on consoles, anyway. Competition between games is what pushed mobile game prices down, even though all sales went through the same app store. That happened because the mobile space was dominated by smaller developers, mostly self-funded and self-publishing, who needed to compete or die. That's not the case with the major publishers and developers.

Steam faces competition from retailers, from other online shops (either selling physical or digital copies), from all the publishers and developers who self-publish, and there's a great deal of competition between games because of the sheer number of smaller publishers or independent developers, combined with the absolutely enormous available back catalog, most of which still works on modern PCs. That, combined with various developers (Valve being the most obvious) who aren't even trying for a US$60 price point in the first place. That's why Steam has decent prices, why games cost less over time, any why they have such frequent sales. Competition, not because of restrictions on what you can do with the games.

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#144
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do I lend a game to my brother who lives on the other side of the U.S.? If you're going to make the argument that discs are "good enough" you sound a bit like people saying letters are "good enough" compared to e-mail. There are obvious advantages to digital content but it sounded like to get those advantages Microsoft decided it needed to add some "DRM-like" experiences. I'm not going to say it was the right tra…

Console gamers are used to having a physical totem of the game. When have you ever been able to easily loan a game to your brother who lives across the country? Really, if you want to do that with a digitally-purchased game, you should just both be buying a copy, for a lot less than that disc would have cost. But MS wasn't willing to say "sorry, you're obsolete" to the game stores, so they weren't saying "hey now you…

People were used to having a phone with no internet too

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#145
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are all extremely different levels of trust. It's useless to treat them as equivalent.

I think the "software vs. hardware" disabling of the Kinect is very similar.

Software vs. hardware means you trust Microsoft to never in the future decide to spy and to never make a coding mistake that could turn the equipment on when it's not supposed to be.

When it comes to teardowns you trust that multiple independent parties aren't all actively lying to you in concert.

I don't see how these are at all similar.

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#146
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This page says it's disabled by software - not by hardware. So it really depends on how much you trust the software and the people making it. The software is closed source and the people making it also happened to be the first ones to sign onto PRISM.

The aftermarket part to disable the Kinect without breaking warranty is not very expensive: http://www.amazon.com/Post--3-Inches-Canary-Yellow-12-Pads/d... Though there are a number of reasons I don't like the Xbox One, the Kinect isn't one of them.

You can disable the camera by turning it around. The microphone is the bigger issue.

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#147
post #41

So: 1) You still have to have the Kinect, and so long as the console is on it, too, will always be on. (And apparently even when the console is off it will still be listening for the "turn on" command. This has implications I'm not comfortable with.) 2) Independent developers will still be prohibited from participating in the Marketplace. 3) It will still be $100 more than the PS4. I've been a 360 owner for several y…

I really REALLY hate the Playstation controls compared to the Xbox controls, but I'm willing to make that sacrifice to save a hundred bucks.

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The aftermarket part to disable the Kinect without breaking warranty is not very expensive: http://www.amazon.com/Post--3-Inches-Canary-Yellow-12-Pads/d... Though there are a number of reasons I don't like the Xbox One, the Kinect isn't one of them.

You can disable the camera by turning it around. The microphone is the bigger issue.

You mean like the microphone found in almost every laptop, tablet, or phone?

I guess the difference with this microphone is that it's listening to you all the time by default, and that creeps some people out. But it's not sending your words over the network, and is not more likely to start doing so than any of the aforementioned devices (actually, much less, because of increased security); it's just pattern matching for the word "Xbox". Kind of like the initial worries over Gmail "reading your email" to target ads: I predict that this too will peter out once people start actually using the product, albeit perhaps never die completely.

(For the record, the fact that Gmail messages can also be read by law enforcement under some circumstances is both a serious issue and irrelevant to the analogy.)

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#149
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Netflix thing is the only one stopping me, really. I love the idea of voice commands (if they work smoothly) and combining my OTA channels with my games. I'm willing to pay an extra $100 for what I assume (and will wait to see verified) will be a much better cohesive media experience than the PS4 that includes those two things. By pay an annual fee for Netflix on top of what I pay Netflix? Never. I also don't car…

pay an annual fee for Netflix on top of what I pay Netflix? Never. Same here! Also, I'm a casual gamer and I go months...YEARS without playing video games. I do not want another subscription that I'm going to forget about. I had an Xbox 360, but I never paid for the Gold service - so the only online gaming in my house is done on my PC workstation. I will probably get a PS4 this time around.

Consider the WiiU. Netflix support and Video Chat, new games that neither system can do.

WiiU + PC will probably get you more coverage than PS4 + PC. As far as I can tell anyway...

Re: Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

#150
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are all extremely different levels of trust. It's useless to treat them as equivalent.

I think the "software vs. hardware" disabling of the Kinect is very similar.

When somebody figures out how to leverage a buffer overflow exploit in order to create a camera or microphone where none exists, then the might be similar.
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