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"Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

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Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#241

Post by Ntrails »

kevdigital wrote: post #204
beloch wrote: post #107

The engineer bases his argument on an assumption that is usually erroneous: The price of a product is related to its cost. This is a logical assumption, but almost always false. It is far more commonly true that the price of a product is dictated by what consumers are willing to pay. If the PS4 version of game X sells for $59.99, it is more than likely that the Xbox1 version will sell for the same price, because peop…

Very good points. The ability for publishers to discount games on steam where they otherwise couldn't in physical retail markets is that they have just one place to set that price and distribute it. MS by eliminating the used game market forces consumers to buy these older games in digital form where publishers can offer these sales. I don't know if that will make them any cheaper than if someone simply bought a used…

I find it similarly mind boggling that owning the discs for PS2 or PS3 games would not entitle me to the digital version for a PS4 (offering previous gen games as downloads was offered I believe?)

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#242

Post by moystard »

ewzimm wrote: post #202
chrisbolt wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the One isn't backwards compatible with any of the 360 games I already bought and are stored in the cloud, which leads me to believe they'll do the same with the Two.

There's no way any of this will reasonably apply if we stick to this seven year cycle. By 2020, this will all be so obsolete, nobody will care about backward compatibility. Do you care that your PS4 is backward compatible with an abacus?

People like you have accepted the fact that they don't own anything they buy. If you are happy to buy a game today, and not being able to play it in a few years because the editor/console manufacturer have decided so, then good for you. On my side, I just want to enjoy what I bought, for as long as I can, and in 2020, I will for sure play 2013 games.

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#243

Post by angersock »

chrisbolt wrote: post #173
ameen wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your analogy doesn't really make sense. Your Xbox account is similar to a Steam account works on PC/360/One and you control the hardware if your One breaks, buy a new one and authenticate it with your account. All your games would now be accessible.

The problem is that the One isn't backwards compatible with any of the 360 games I already bought and are stored in the cloud, which leads me to believe they'll do the same with the Two.

Oh for fuck's sake the 360 was a PowerPC arch, and the new Xbox is x86. This is so dumb.

You know how PS3 used to support old games? It had the old Emotion Engine (PS2 cpu) built directly into their system--it was a turducken of processing.

"wah wah wah i cant run my games from a different processor architecture wah wah wah" this is dumb anyone thinking this is dumb

EDIT: Less insulting.

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#244

Post by gr3yh47 »

I'm getting really sick of console DRM being compared to Steam DRM like they are equals. they aren't, not even close, because steam has sales 2x a year where even brand new games can be had for up to 75% off

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#245

Post by to3m »

angersock wrote: post #243
chrisbolt wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the One isn't backwards compatible with any of the 360 games I already bought and are stored in the cloud, which leads me to believe they'll do the same with the Two.

Oh for fuck's sake the 360 was a PowerPC arch, and the new Xbox is x86. This is so dumb. You know how PS3 used to support old games? It had the old Emotion Engine (PS2 cpu) built directly into their system--it was a turducken of processing. "wah wah wah i cant run my games from a different processor architecture wah wah wah" this is dumb anyone thinking this is dumb EDIT: Less insulting.

You should get a PR job at Microsoft. I'm sure this line of argument would help convince people.

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#246

Post by lucian1900 »

The comparison to Steam entirely breaks down when you consider that Steam is opt-in, whereas the Xbone's DRM is not even opt-out, but entirely mandatory.

The main reason I don't complain so much about steam is the existence of GoG and direct DRM-free sales (Humble store), which I always prefer if they carry the game I'm interested in.

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#247

Post by debian69 »

mortenjorck wrote: post #119
nostromo wrote: post #72

The real misstep here is that Microsoft is still selling physical media. Nobody (well, almost nobody) gets mad when they can't resell their iPhone games or mp3s or Kindle books; compare that to the outpouring of anger when a company puts limitations on used optical media games or CDs or books. Humans are wired to see a physical item (disks, etc.) and think mine .

Humans are wired to see a physical item (disks, etc.) and think *mine.* Well, yes, but you oversimplify. There is a long-established doctrine of first-sale in the US, and it's not just part of case law, it's part of the culture. The non-resaleability of Kindle books or anything else digital is still new to the popular mind, and carries with it a certain implicit devaluation. Even though most people at least abstractl…

Why disc ? The problem is downloading 50 gb a game is pretty impossible for most..

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#248

Post by debian69 »

nrivadeneira wrote: post #96
ianlevesque wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All four examples you gave are in decline. His viewpoint is shared by a growing segment of the population.

Advertisements are not the reason they're in decline. People don't sign up for Netflix because it's ad-free, they sign-up for convenience.

THe ad freeness is a great pull though..

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#249

Post by angersock »

to3m wrote: post #245
angersock wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh for fuck's sake the 360 was a PowerPC arch, and the new Xbox is x86. This is so dumb. You know how PS3 used to support old games? It had the old Emotion Engine (PS2 cpu) built directly into their system--it was a turducken of processing. "wah wah wah i cant run my games from a different processor architecture wah wah wah" this is dumb anyone thinking this is dumb EDIT: Less insulting.

You should get a PR job at Microsoft. I'm sure this line of argument would help convince people.

They seem to be getting along quite well without my wit and charm. :|

This particular category of complaint is very, very common to people that don't understand the technology that they use past the "push shiny buttan on the ui" level. Anybody who has ever touched native code in their life knows that porting applications from different operating system versions--much less processor families!--is non-trivial. But to gamers, oh no, they need to be able to play an old game that technology has passed by--and yet, they specifically went out and bought a goddamned information appliance instead of an engine of computation that they could own and maintain themselves. They brought this on themselves.

Gamers are always "me me me, i want this, wah wah wah". There is not a single customer demographic I can think of that is less interested in understanding their tools and more vocal about the slightest inconvenience, real or otherwise. The worst of them are the ones that have nothing to do but pass of hatred and vitriol online to other gamers, sometimes even passing it off as "games criticism", like they're fucking Ebert or something.

And honestly, we caused this. We catered to gamers, we made their lives so simple and carefree and priced things so low that they are literally the worst customers on earth.

My friends in the web business? Look at this. Look at what these people have become, and expect the same sort of shitty behavior from your users in five-ten years.

Re: "Microsoft engineer" on Xbox1

#250

Post by benbeltran »

shock-value wrote: post #155
sirclueless wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't really work. The game is still supposed to be $60 at launch, that's when games make the most money, they really are worth that much (and more) as evidenced by the many people who pay that much for them, even on DRM-laden platforms like Steam. The point is to let the price fall faster after launch. Xbox can't exactly promise "Our games' prices will fall faster than the other guys" because the market will…

The thing is I really don't see Sony as being on the "wrong side of history" though since they are still having day-one downloads of all titles. They are just fully supporting both models (traditional discs and one-copy-per-user digital downloads) rather than forcing everyone into one. They are literally doing everything that MS is doing with digital, yet still having discs (and therefore offline play) as an option.

Not only that, they went a step forward and made downloads even more appealing by allowing you to download the minimum possible to play the game, and just do the rest while you play.
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