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Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

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Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#31

Post by meritt »

jacquesm wrote: post #15
meritt wrote: post #14

Stop focusing on Snowden, hero or traitor, he's probably fake. The revelation is important, not the messenger. The idea of "Snowden" is critically important -- citizens standing up against government overreach -- but him as an individual is immaterial.

Fake?

I was suggesting the Snowden interview could be intentionally staged to create a distraction from the bigger issue. Which it's done really well. Now everyone is talking about Snowden, whether he's a traitor or a hero, why this inexperienced kid had all this access to "the entire intelligence community", etc.

If he is real, he's going off the radar for his own protection. If he gets picked up by the CIA, he's going off the radar. If he's fake, he's going off the radar too. He's going to disappear regardless.

I think it's an unnecessary distraction from the core issue of the US government having unfettered spying access.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#32

Post by youngerdryas »

radicalcut wrote: post #8

Is there an article or initial analysis somewhere summarizing all that's known right now about this scary NSA/PRISM business (with links to sources ideally)? Or is it still too soon for such a thing? I'm participating in a Google Student Ambassador program at my university and since I've always stressed the importance of privacy (especially in the era of the cloud) I feel obligated to educate my friends and colleague…

All that exists so far is four vaguely worded power point slides, although their is allegedly a lot more which is not being released for unknown reasons.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#33

Post by exodust »

I still don't understand this whole thing.

Why oh why didn't Snowden's interviewer ask him to explain the tech giant's denial of PRISM? And their denial in general of government access to their data beyond the court-ordered variety we all knew about?

I really doubt all the tech giants are spinning the same prepared lie about not knowing anything. And if they're not lying, then where does that leave Snowden's accusations?

Maybe PRISM does exist, but maybe it has limits and can't access everything it wants to, but only everything that can already be scraped? In which case, who the hell cares, we all know mass data scraping and mining is going on with our public shares and comments. Maybe PRISM does this really well, but then, again.. what's the big deal?

The alternative is almost too far-fetched... that the tech giants are all lying (unlikely); that PRISM has access to their protected data without their knowledge (still unlikely); or that PRISM is fed the data via insiders within the tech giants who are like IT spies - which would make the best hollywood movie. I'd call it PRISM GAMES. Oliver Stone, stay away... you're not touching this after your 9/11 effort.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#34

Post by chatmasta »

exodust wrote: post #33

I still don't understand this whole thing. Why oh why didn't Snowden's interviewer ask him to explain the tech giant's denial of PRISM? And their denial in general of government access to their data beyond the court-ordered variety we all knew about? I really doubt all the tech giants are spinning the same prepared lie about not knowing anything. And if they're not lying, then where does that leave Snowden's accusati…

Or, quite simply, that "PRISM" is the name of the automated system for facilitating FISA requests.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#35

Post by famousactress »

chatmasta wrote: post #34
exodust wrote: post #33

I still don't understand this whole thing. Why oh why didn't Snowden's interviewer ask him to explain the tech giant's denial of PRISM? And their denial in general of government access to their data beyond the court-ordered variety we all knew about? I really doubt all the tech giants are spinning the same prepared lie about not knowing anything. And if they're not lying, then where does that leave Snowden's accusati…

Or, quite simply, that "PRISM" is the name of the automated system for facilitating FISA requests.

Isn't the biggest challenge to this idea the letter from GOOG that made the rounds yesterday asking DoJ for the ability to publish aggregate numbers of these, which it implies will be evidence that this kind of large scale automation isn't happening?

http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2013/06/asking-us-government-...

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#36

Post by Aloisius »

exodust wrote: post #33

I still don't understand this whole thing. Why oh why didn't Snowden's interviewer ask him to explain the tech giant's denial of PRISM? And their denial in general of government access to their data beyond the court-ordered variety we all knew about? I really doubt all the tech giants are spinning the same prepared lie about not knowing anything. And if they're not lying, then where does that leave Snowden's accusati…

Well there is a third alternative; the NSA has agents within these companies that covertly acquire the information requested and/or give direct access to the NSA without these companies' knowledge.

For some services such as Google, a single network administrator and a single fiber drop close to Google HQ would probably be all that is necessary. At that point, their own hackers could go to work.

It isn't like a well-trained NSA employee would have trouble getting a job at any of these companies.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#38

Post by jjtheblunt »

ra wrote: post #9
cdooh wrote: post #7

I have to agree that in his actions the public benefit by far outwieghs the "security" risk. In a country where people have been blocked from travelling for mentioning "bomb" and "airport" in the same tweet it's not really shocking that the security apparatus is monitoring the internet. Like he mentioned there's a reason Osama's home had no internet or phone connection. So this leak only does one thing, show the exte…

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

Bologna. Tell that to a veteran who sustained bodily injury.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#39

Post by redblacktree »

jjtheblunt wrote: post #38
ra wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

Bologna. Tell that to a veteran who sustained bodily injury.

What?

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#40

Post by betterunix »

ra wrote: post #9
cdooh wrote: post #7

I have to agree that in his actions the public benefit by far outwieghs the "security" risk. In a country where people have been blocked from travelling for mentioning "bomb" and "airport" in the same tweet it's not really shocking that the security apparatus is monitoring the internet. Like he mentioned there's a reason Osama's home had no internet or phone connection. So this leak only does one thing, show the exte…

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

"I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win."

You are almost certainly wrong. Most terrorists have political goals that have nothing to do with US civil liberties and more to do with foreign policy.

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