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Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

cs.jhu.edu

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Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#71

Post by [deleted] »

VLM wrote: post #59
TylerE wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually good security practice. If the terrorist's find out they got flagged because of X, now they know not to do X any more.

If, by X, you mean "go thru airport security". Luckily our borders are an impermeable wall stronger than the cold war era berlin wall, so there's no alternative method for bad guy to enter the country. This is the comedy of the whole security theater system. In the old days generals always prepared to refight the last war, in the fatherland security era its about the same concept. The next attack will not come from a…

[deleted]

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#72

Post by johnyzee »

piqufoh wrote: post #62
Mithaldu wrote: post #55

The one thing I'm taking home from that letter is this: the embassy called him back to say that they had found the problem. They said that if he came in, they would fix it. Instead of fixing it, they stamped CANCELED across his student visa without explaining what was wrong, and refused to answer any questions as to why. In short: The american embassy has no compunctions whatsoever to lie to citizens of other countri…

This part is breathtakingly bad, but also largely subjective - we may never know what they really said...

If only we had records...

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#73

Post by pfortuny »

When the US has access to approx 10 billion 'metadata' from Jordanian citicens (probably more, I am quoting from memory), it means it has access to ALL their communications.

So if this poor man just happened to have the wrong social graph...

"We found the problem with your visa [silence]".

The [silence] means: there should be a 'CANCELLED' stamp on it. Why bother?

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#74

Post by davidw »

Zigurd wrote: post #68
davidw wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think HN is seriously at risk of having jumped the shark for good. This NSA thing blew the lid off - the front page is completely full of articles about politics, with more each day about all kinds of different things. I suppose things may settle down again - they have after other big events, but... I worry, I worry. (And for the record, for those who conflate not wanting to see every article about this with not ca…

The PRISM scandal remains a threat to US tech businesses. Long after it fades from HN, it will be a drag on growth. Since government credibility will be hard to repair, a big part of the solution is likely going to be stronger technical measures against any kind of snooping.

I do think it's relevant, and not some completely off-topic political thing. However, it's given way to a bunch more politics - people denied entry to the US, "there are nukes in the netherlands", and so on, and filled the front page, crowding out pretty much everything else.

I just get a feeling that this is a turning point for the site, but only time will tell.

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#76

Post by davidw »

irollboozers wrote: post #56
davidw wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think HN is seriously at risk of having jumped the shark for good. This NSA thing blew the lid off - the front page is completely full of articles about politics, with more each day about all kinds of different things. I suppose things may settle down again - they have after other big events, but... I worry, I worry. (And for the record, for those who conflate not wanting to see every article about this with not ca…

I disagree, these are 'big' problems, and exposure of these pain points to other smart entrepreneurs can only lead to a net benefit.

These are political problems that will be fixed by "politics" in its various forms: people making their voices heard, politicians doing their thing, donating money to organizations, lawsuits, stuff like that. Lots of hard work.

They will not be fixed because you clicked the 'upvote' arrow on a bunch of stories on a niche site, thinking that "some smart entrepreneur types" will go fix the problem for you.

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#77

Post by Spearchucker »

nashequilibrium wrote: post #37
sp332 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worst one I know of was when they wouldn't let Nelson Mandela into the country because some computer had flagged him as having ties to terrorist groups. Condoleezza Rice personally went to the airport to wave him through security. She was so mad, she might have single-handedly taken the teeth out of that system. Edit: more info, and some evidence that I was right :) http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-…

The reason Nelson Mandela and the whole ANC party who fought apartheid were on the no fly list is because they were labelled as a terrorist group. Nobody bothered to adjust this until a couple of embarrassing moments like this. It is kind of funny that the apartheid government were never denied entry to any country, yet the people fighting an oppressive government were labelled as terrorist. It is also surprising tha…

...the people fighting an oppressive government were labelled as terrorist...

Not surprising at all.

Dig into the history of the ANC a little. Specifically, look for Umkhonto we Sizwe after the Sharpeville massacre in 1960.

While in no way [edit] trivialising the abhorrent and often vicious apartheid regime of the time, the ANC (and Mandela) haven't exactly been angles, either.

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#78

Post by robomartin »

UnoriginalGuy wrote: post #12

I wonder if this is one of those vague "security" problems. It seems like if people get denied for normal stuff (overstaying, violating their visas, etc) they're told and can at least fight it a little. But when you get a black mark against you it seems like you get stuck in an administrative blackhole where nobody is authorised to tell you WHY or they themselves don't know. It was the same way with the no-fly list f…

> Americans don't want people visiting, working, or studying on their shores.

This is utterly false and unfair. Please don't lump the entire US population with a few ignorant morons who have not seen the world five miles outside their home town. A quick look at our universities is proof enough that what you are saying is incorrect. The last time I visited MIT it almost felt like I was outside the US.

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#79

Post by Spearchucker »

mikeash wrote: post #39
sp332 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worst one I know of was when they wouldn't let Nelson Mandela into the country because some computer had flagged him as having ties to terrorist groups. Condoleezza Rice personally went to the airport to wave him through security. She was so mad, she might have single-handedly taken the teeth out of that system. Edit: more info, and some evidence that I was right :) http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-…

I find the "some computer" comment a bit odd, because Nelson Mandela most certainly did have ties to terrorist groups. He co-founded one. This is not a swipe against Mandela in any way. It's just an example that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, and how rigid systems can end up giving you politically inconvenient results. If you make a blanket rule that people with ties to terrorism cannot enter t…

Mandela didn't found anything. He started out as a militant leader in Umkhonto we Sizwe (translates as "Spear of the Nation"), which was the military wing of the ANC.

Re: Jordanian citizen was denied re-entry to the US on eve of his PhD defense at JHU

#80

Post by genwin »

xanmas wrote: post #52
OldSchool wrote: post #50

He sounds like a brilliant student. However does anyone find it the least bit noteworthy that the US government is paying for foreign citizens' tuition and stipends while many of its own citizens are forced to go deeply in debt?

PhD students, especially in the sciences, don't pay tuition.

Nice to know my taxes pay for the lofty education of people who may have no intention of working in my country.
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