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NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

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Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#131

Post by michaelwww »

jleader wrote: post #115
jfisher wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dear U.S. Navy, Where are your nuclear subs and what are their missions? Sincerely, Definitely a U.S. citizen

Why exactly do we still need nuclear subs? I'm not trying to be a troll, or funny. What threat is currently best dealt with by deploying ICBMs in nuclear subs? And why is the money better spent on that than on any other alternative use?

I rode subs for awhile and your question is a fair question. Subs with nuke missiles are an insurance policy. They are a deterrent, insuring no country can attack the U.S. - no matter how successful - and not expect a massive and devastating counter-attack. Run silent, run deep.

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#132

Post by tptacek »

bicknergseng wrote: post #126
jleader wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why exactly do we still need nuclear subs? I'm not trying to be a troll, or funny. What threat is currently best dealt with by deploying ICBMs in nuclear subs? And why is the money better spent on that than on any other alternative use?

I'm curious why we need both a nuclear deterrent and a standing army of 1,127,801 people. Seems like more of an XOR.

So, when some large military power cuts off shipping lanes in the Pacific, we'd, what, threaten to nuke them? That's a better state affairs than what we have today?

Conversely: what goes does a standing army of 1,127,801 people do you if your adversary has nuclear weapons?

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#134

Post by mkmkmmmmm »

JamisonM wrote: post #124
guelo wrote: post #104

We don't need an NSA or CIA or any other spy agency. I know I'm an extremist on government secrets, but I think there should be none. Nothing should be outside the reach of a FOIA request. In my ideal world all government officials' documents and emails would be made publicly accesible in real time, they're working for us. Any exception or loophole to transparency gets abused, every time. If that makes it harder to c…

There are an absurd number of things that it makes sense for the government to keep from the public and not divesting that information but keeping the people who have that information accountable is what elections are for. You want to know what officers are working under cover in the police force? Who are informants on terrorist organizations working against the state? The home phone numbers and addresses of all publ…

You are correct. But also there is not much an election can do when they have rigged the elections with Gerrymandering and first across the fence voting. There's a district in one state that goes out to sea and back. Corrupt as fuck.

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#135

Post by jaekwon »

JamisonM wrote: post #124
guelo wrote: post #104

We don't need an NSA or CIA or any other spy agency. I know I'm an extremist on government secrets, but I think there should be none. Nothing should be outside the reach of a FOIA request. In my ideal world all government officials' documents and emails would be made publicly accesible in real time, they're working for us. Any exception or loophole to transparency gets abused, every time. If that makes it harder to c…

There are an absurd number of things that it makes sense for the government to keep from the public and not divesting that information but keeping the people who have that information accountable is what elections are for. You want to know what officers are working under cover in the police force? Who are informants on terrorist organizations working against the state? The home phone numbers and addresses of all publ…

If this guy had leaked that kind of information, he wouldn't be in the news like he is now. PRISM is not the kind of work that government has to do.

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#136

Post by nano111 »

JamisonM wrote: post #124
guelo wrote: post #104

We don't need an NSA or CIA or any other spy agency. I know I'm an extremist on government secrets, but I think there should be none. Nothing should be outside the reach of a FOIA request. In my ideal world all government officials' documents and emails would be made publicly accesible in real time, they're working for us. Any exception or loophole to transparency gets abused, every time. If that makes it harder to c…

There are an absurd number of things that it makes sense for the government to keep from the public and not divesting that information but keeping the people who have that information accountable is what elections are for. You want to know what officers are working under cover in the police force? Who are informants on terrorist organizations working against the state? The home phone numbers and addresses of all publ…

JamisonM--

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#137

Post by pappyo »

guelo wrote: post #104

We don't need an NSA or CIA or any other spy agency. I know I'm an extremist on government secrets, but I think there should be none. Nothing should be outside the reach of a FOIA request. In my ideal world all government officials' documents and emails would be made publicly accesible in real time, they're working for us. Any exception or loophole to transparency gets abused, every time. If that makes it harder to c…

Unfortunately we don't live in a world of ideals.

With complete transparency comes little ability for security. Terrorist attempts become more frequent. Crime becomes more rampant and life become more unstable.

If you ask a typical American if they are willing to die for their freedom, very few would. They'd rather the security. I'm not saying that's right or wrong, it's just true.

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#139

Post by shirro »

rayiner wrote: post #117
jleader wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why exactly do we still need nuclear subs? I'm not trying to be a troll, or funny. What threat is currently best dealt with by deploying ICBMs in nuclear subs? And why is the money better spent on that than on any other alternative use?

China and Russia.

Perhaps on paper. But being a global power gives the US a special relationship with friendly countries as well. The dependency on US military protection subverts the sovereignty of allied nations causing them to harmonise laws on intellectual property, drugs, share intelligence including information about businesses in competition with US ones amongst other things. It is a very advantageous situation for the USA and I think it is wrong to think the only point of being a global superpower is to keep the Russians and Chinese in line. It is as much about maintaining the Empire and keeping the client states in line. Hail Caeser!

Re: NSA leaker is a patriot, not a traitor

#140

Post by grecy »

guelo wrote: post #104

We don't need an NSA or CIA or any other spy agency. I know I'm an extremist on government secrets, but I think there should be none. Nothing should be outside the reach of a FOIA request. In my ideal world all government officials' documents and emails would be made publicly accesible in real time, they're working for us. Any exception or loophole to transparency gets abused, every time. If that makes it harder to c…

My girlfriend works for a branch of the Canadian government.

All of her emails, meeting minutes, agendas, etc. are all on the public record. Anyone can search/read/whatever them at any time.

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