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Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

reuters.com

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Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#61

Post by adventured »

enraged_camel wrote: post #44
mtgx wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently, they do. FISA spying has been found unconstitutional since 2011, but they are keeping it a secret: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/06/government-says-secret... This is happening in the "beacon of democracy" of the world.

For the record, the only people who see the USA as the "beacon of democracy" are Americans. I'm not saying this to start a flame war, but to simply point out that the USA is no more democratic than many other Western nations. (My personal opinion is that the USA is much more of a beacon of imperialism than of democracy. But that's neither here nor there.)

The US was never a beacon of democracy. That's not a desirable goal.

It was a Constitutional Republic.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#62

Post by philwelch »

claudius wrote: post #18
philwelch wrote: post #11

It's incredible how the presence of the word "leaks" turns the whole headline from promising to sinister. Why can't they investigate the NSA for once? Isn't that what a democratic country would do?

It appears this was justified by a specific law that was passed by the representatives of the people for the people, so why should they investigate the NSA, especially in a democratic country?

Well, representatives of the gerrymanders for the gerrymanders.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#63

Post by EWRWE »

http://www.redabogados.net/profile/proyectoencuestaVenezuela Lawyers. Net - URGENT We pay 700 million USD to SEVEN MILLION DOLLARS Lawyers for Vallejos case. SEVEN present all tests.

Drafting and filing of the Petition and complaint to the Inter American Court The Hague and the UN.

On behalf of Juan Carlos Vallejos, mental torture case, a citizen of Venezuela

Resides in the state of Carabobo, Valencia, identity card, CI 12,108,222,

The following presidents denounce North Americans, Europeans, Asians and Latin Americans.

For genocide, administrations (2002-2013).

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------

COMPLAINT FOR MURDER, THEFT, VIOLATION, DRUG, TERRORIST USING SATELLITES AND NANO TECHNOLOGY,

WITH VISUAL INFORMATION OBTAINED WHICH ACTIVITIES PERFORMED IN dferentes ETAD BY CONBENIO

VALLEJOS IF, WITH NICOLAS MATURE POLITICO.

1. - THE PRESIDENT BARAK OBAMA, MICHELLE OBAMA, FROM THE 2000 REPORT DATE OF WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
Note: * 1. - PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA, 2000 FROM THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT WHICH WIFE WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
2. - THE PRESIDENT OF JAPAN FROM 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
3. - PRIME MINISTER FROM NORTH KOREA 2000 DATE OF REPORT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
4. - PRIME MINISTER OF CHINA SINCE 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
5. - PRIME MINISTER OF JAPAN FROM 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
-------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------

1. - The President of Germany.

2. - The Spanish state and its president.

3. - The Swiss state and politicians of their respective cantons.

4. - President of Russia.

5. - The President of Japan.

6. - Prime Minister of China.

7. - Prime Minister of North Korea.

8. - Prime Minister of South Korea, Ban Quee Moon.

9. - The president of Italy.

10. - The president of Canada.

11. - Portugal Anibal Antonio Cavaco Silva and sons Teodoro Patrícia Gonçalves Silva Cavaco Silva.

12. - Mariano Rajoy Brey.

13. - Antoni MARTI PETIT.

14. - Francois Hollande.

15. - Minister of State) Michel ROGER.

16. - Joachim gauck.

17. - Corina Casanova.

18. - AUSTRIA PRESIDENT: Heinz FISCHER.

19. - LIECHTENSTEIN: (Prime Minister) Klaus STCHUTSCHER.

20. - ITALY: PRESIDENT: Giorgio NAPOLITANO.

21. - PRIME MINISTER: Mario Monti.

22. - BELARUS: Aleksandr Lukashenko.

23. - ARMENIA: Serzh SARGSYAN.

24. - RUSSIA: Prime Minister Fredrik REINFELDT.

25. - SWEDEN: President Vladimir Vladimirovich PUTIN.

26. - Felipe González.

27. - José María Aznar.

We include other presidents that allow the satellite, 2013:

1. - The president of Colombia.

2. - The president of Argentina.

3. - The president of Brazil.

4. - The president of Ecuador.

5. - President of Cuba.

6. - The president of Mexico.

7. - Nicolas Maduro.

They all perform in Venezuela satellite transmissions.

Genocide crimes.

Some of the tests.

http://www.liberenlosya.com/foros/?mingleforumaction=viewfor...

Juan Carlos Vallejos.

To the Judges and Lawyer Professionals working in international criminal law.

Complaints that we would like to present in these courts include theft business models:

    Perfectible Bank which have video and is the main reason why these agencies perform the cauterization, radiation and torture in Juan Carlos Vallejos.
    Wells Extraction System terminals, designed for extraction of heavy hydro carbons.
    The allowances include asking for the victim, that the radiations which occurred for 14 years and the loss of telomeres of each DNA molecule, be paid to the victim, the amount of $ 1,000,000 for each telomere that was lost because of radiation.
We have all the evidence to prove it.

We made the complaint in the Supreme Court of the state of Carabobo, Valencia, however these records are stolen.

The complaint shall be presented by professionals abogados.net, to the competent courts, the complainant, Juan Carlos Vallejos, Chilean, residing in Venezuela, Carabobo, Valencia, Camoruco valleys, street 133, Lopez Latouche, (this is the street Red Cross), Altamira apt bldg 1-b.

Payment for the services of lawyers, is 60% of the amount of compensation. The approximate amount for those who are not geneticists is $ 700 million, seven hundred million dollars.

Even so you can negotiate the payment.

We publish the emails, but the ideal is to communicate by phone.

Jcvcorredoresinmobiliarios@yahoo.com, casaenventa2@gamil.com, r_vallejos@yahoo.com

Phones: Venezuela + (0058) 0241-823-81-97 / 0414-585-00-44 / 0414-406-68-52 - In case you can not contact the secretary contact the consulate of Chile, Rosalia Vasquez + (0058) 0212-953-14-85 is Vallejos family friend.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#64

Post by EWRWE »

http://www.redabogados.net/profile/proyectoencuestaVenezuela Lawyers. Net - URGENT We pay 700 million USD to SEVEN MILLION DOLLARS Lawyers for Vallejos case. SEVEN present all tests.

Drafting and filing of the Petition and complaint to the Inter American Court The Hague and the UN.

On behalf of Juan Carlos Vallejos, mental torture case, a citizen of Venezuela

Resides in the state of Carabobo, Valencia, identity card, CI 12,108,222,

The following presidents denounce North Americans, Europeans, Asians and Latin Americans.

For genocide, administrations (2002-2013).

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------

COMPLAINT FOR MURDER, THEFT, VIOLATION, DRUG, TERRORIST USING SATELLITES AND NANO TECHNOLOGY,

WITH VISUAL INFORMATION OBTAINED WHICH ACTIVITIES PERFORMED IN dferentes ETAD BY CONBENIO

VALLEJOS IF, WITH NICOLAS MATURE POLITICO.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#65

Post by EWRWE »

paul wrote: post #22

If the government hasn't done anything wrong, then they shouldn't have anything to hide from us :) More seriously, some amount of surveillance is probably necessary, but they need to be a lot more open and transparent about it. Secret laws and secret courts are not the stuff a free society is made of.

http://www.redabogados.net/profile/proyectoencuestaVenezuela Lawyers. Net - URGENT We pay 700 million USD to SEVEN MILLION DOLLARS Lawyers for Vallejos case. SEVEN present all tests.

Drafting and filing of the Petition and complaint to the Inter American Court The Hague and the UN.

On behalf of Juan Carlos Vallejos, mental torture case, a citizen of Venezuela

Resides in the state of Carabobo, Valencia, identity card, CI 12,108,222,

The following presidents denounce North Americans, Europeans, Asians and Latin Americans.

For genocide, administrations (2002-2013).

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------

COMPLAINT FOR MURDER, THEFT, VIOLATION, DRUG, TERRORIST USING SATELLITES AND NANO TECHNOLOGY,

WITH VISUAL INFORMATION OBTAINED WHICH ACTIVITIES PERFORMED IN dferentes ETAD BY CONBENIO

VALLEJOS IF, WITH NICOLAS MATURE POLITICO.

1. - THE PRESIDENT BARAK OBAMA, MICHELLE OBAMA, FROM THE 2000 REPORT DATE OF WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
Note: * 1. - PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA, 2000 FROM THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT WHICH WIFE WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
2. - THE PRESIDENT OF JAPAN FROM 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
3. - PRIME MINISTER FROM NORTH KOREA 2000 DATE OF REPORT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
4. - PRIME MINISTER OF CHINA SINCE 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
5. - PRIME MINISTER OF JAPAN FROM 2000 THE DATE OF THE COMPLAINT 2013.

  WIFE WHICH WE SEND THE COMPLAINT.

  SAW HIS DAUGHTERS THE COMPLAINT WHICH PUBLISHED IN THEIR BLOGS.
-------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------

1. - The President of Germany.

2. - The Spanish state and its president.

3. - The Swiss state and politicians of their respective cantons.

4. - President of Russia.

5. - The President of Japan.

6. - Prime Minister of China.

7. - Prime Minister of North Korea.

8. - Prime Minister of South Korea, Ban Quee Moon.

9. - The president of Italy.

10. - The president of Canada.

11. - Portugal Anibal Antonio Cavaco Silva and sons Teodoro Patrícia Gonçalves Silva Cavaco Silva.

12. - Mariano Rajoy Brey.

13. - Antoni MARTI PETIT.

14. - Francois Hollande.

15. - Minister of State) Michel ROGER.

16. - Joachim gauck.

17. - Corina Casanova.

18. - AUSTRIA PRESIDENT: Heinz FISCHER.

19. - LIECHTENSTEIN: (Prime Minister) Klaus STCHUTSCHER.

20. - ITALY: PRESIDENT: Giorgio NAPOLITANO.

21. - PRIME MINISTER: Mario Monti.

22. - BELARUS: Aleksandr Lukashenko.

23. - ARMENIA: Serzh SARGSYAN.

24. - RUSSIA: Prime Minister Fredrik REINFELDT.

25. - SWEDEN: President Vladimir Vladimirovich PUTIN.

26. - Felipe González.

27. - José María Aznar.

We include other presidents that allow the satellite, 2013:

1. - The president of Colombia.

2. - The president of Argentina.

3. - The president of Brazil.

4. - The president of Ecuador.

5. - President of Cuba.

6. - The president of Mexico.

7. - Nicolas Maduro.

They all perform in Venezuela satellite transmissions.

Genocide crimes.

Some of the tests.

http://www.liberenlosya.com/foros/?mingleforumaction=viewfor...

Juan Carlos Vallejos.

To the Judges and Lawyer Professionals working in international criminal law.

Complaints that we would like to present in these courts include theft business models:

    Perfectible Bank which have video and is the main reason why these agencies perform the cauterization, radiation and torture in Juan Carlos Vallejos.
    Wells Extraction System terminals, designed for extraction of heavy hydro carbons.
    The allowances include asking for the victim, that the radiations which occurred for 14 years and the loss of telomeres of each DNA molecule, be paid to the victim, the amount of $ 1,000,000 for each telomere that was lost because of radiation.
We have all the evidence to prove it.

We made the complaint in the Supreme Court of the state of Carabobo, Valencia, however these records are stolen.

The complaint shall be presented by professionals abogados.net, to the competent courts, the complainant, Juan Carlos Vallejos, Chilean, residing in Venezuela, Carabobo, Valencia, Camoruco valleys, street 133, Lopez Latouche, (this is the street Red Cross), Altamira apt bldg 1-b.

Payment for the services of lawyers, is 60% of the amount of compensation. The approximate amount for those who are not geneticists is $ 700 million, seven hundred million dollars.

Even so you can negotiate the payment.

We publish the emails, but the ideal is to communicate by phone.

Jcvcorredoresinmobiliarios@yahoo.com, casaenventa2@gamil.com, r_vallejos@yahoo.com

Phones: Venezuela + (0058) 0241-823-81-97 / 0414-585-00-44 / 0414-406-68-52 - In case you can not contact the secretary contact the consulate of Chile, Rosalia Vasquez + (0058) 0212-953-14-85 is Vallejos family friend.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#66

Post by philwelch »

adventured wrote: post #61
enraged_camel wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the record, the only people who see the USA as the "beacon of democracy" are Americans. I'm not saying this to start a flame war, but to simply point out that the USA is no more democratic than many other Western nations. (My personal opinion is that the USA is much more of a beacon of imperialism than of democracy. But that's neither here nor there.)

The US was never a beacon of democracy. That's not a desirable goal. It was a Constitutional Republic.

This semantic argument is completely tiresome. There's no contradiction between being a democracy and being a republic. The US is a democratic republic. Non-democratic republics include ancient Rome and 18th-century America (where slaves couldn't vote). Democratic non-republics include the UK, Canada, and Holland (which are monarchies).

"Republic" doesn't actually mean anything aside from "not a monarchy". When the founders of the United States wrote movingly about being a republic, they were firstly trying to emulate Rome and secondly trying to emphasize the then-popular Enlightenment ideal that monarchies were outdated and it was better to govern explicitly in the name of the people.

(The word "republic" emulates Rome because it's the term used by and for the Roman state. It's derived from the Latin "res publica", for "public property", which is exactly synonymous with the English word "commonwealth".)

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#68

Post by SCAQTony »

paul wrote: post #22

If the government hasn't done anything wrong, then they shouldn't have anything to hide from us :) More seriously, some amount of surveillance is probably necessary, but they need to be a lot more open and transparent about it. Secret laws and secret courts are not the stuff a free society is made of.

Outrageous! they break the law by violating our fourth amendment and then they launch a "criminal investigation" to punish those that came forward to report the violation.

Secret laws and secret courts are illegal.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#69

Post by hughlomas »

enraged_camel wrote: post #44
mtgx wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently, they do. FISA spying has been found unconstitutional since 2011, but they are keeping it a secret: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/06/government-says-secret... This is happening in the "beacon of democracy" of the world.

For the record, the only people who see the USA as the "beacon of democracy" are Americans. I'm not saying this to start a flame war, but to simply point out that the USA is no more democratic than many other Western nations. (My personal opinion is that the USA is much more of a beacon of imperialism than of democracy. But that's neither here nor there.)

The United States, despite what it may now be, has a historical foundation as the "beacon of democracy". The seeds of philosophies from antiquity and the enlightenment took root in the founding of the country, and the United States pioneered modern western democracy.

Re: Government likely to open criminal probe into NSA leaks

#70

Post by jlgreco »

hughlomas wrote: post #69
enraged_camel wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the record, the only people who see the USA as the "beacon of democracy" are Americans. I'm not saying this to start a flame war, but to simply point out that the USA is no more democratic than many other Western nations. (My personal opinion is that the USA is much more of a beacon of imperialism than of democracy. But that's neither here nor there.)

The United States, despite what it may now be, has a historical foundation as the "beacon of democracy". The seeds of philosophies from antiquity and the enlightenment took root in the founding of the country, and the United States pioneered modern western democracy.

I don't think "beacons" work through time like that. I don't think you would say that Damascus is a "beacon of medical science", though there was once a time (preceding and during the Islamic Golden Age) that you could have certainly said that.
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