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Stellar Wind (code name)

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Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#71

Post by _account »

alexvr wrote: post #20

Does anyone know how they do this, technically, and to what extent? Does Google just feed them billions of emails, or what? Do they type my name into a form on Amazon.com to get SSH access my EC2 server? And how the hell do they see my finances? Do all of those terms of service agreements say, "By the way, we give your private information to the government without question" ??? At first I thought it didn't matter tha…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

They use network taps[robust ones] to sift thru the unencrypted traffic[most email traffic and regular net traffic]...and most likely a close relationship with the SSL cert-auth roots to scrutinize the 'secure' stuff.

Anything else encrypted in place is most likely sent to Oak Ridge or there own HPC clusters and bf'd.

Defense?

AES 256 with loooooooong and strong passphrases and keyfiles. and generate your own SSL certs[4096 min]....and use VPN's which terminate out of country and don't keep logs.

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#72

Post by rayiner »

tossedaside57 wrote: post #69
rayiner wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just look at how much "oh my god I can't believe the public doesn't care about this" angst has bubbled up in the HN threads on the NSA's actions. Amusingly, you see the same sort of rejection of democratic consensus from some extremist feminists ("women can't be trusted to know what they want because they've been brainwashed by the patriarchy.")

Geeks internalize the network. It's like an extension of their mind and body. Intrude into their online activities and you might as well be touching them in their no-touchy zone. You sound like a bleeding "blame the victim" sexual harassment apologist. All the other secretaries are okay with the bosses' constant groping, what's the big deal? Maybe they like being touched. You were asking for it by dressing that way (…

It's interesting that you mention groping. The tort of battery is evaluated according to an objective standard: would a reasonable person consider the contact offensive? It is defined by social norms: grabbing someone's ass is offensive, bumping into someone on a crowded subway is not.

So your point fails even within the four corners of your analogy. That secretary will have a pretty tough time arguing that her boss's handshake was sexual battery, even if she belongs to an obscure religion that considers hands to be sexual objects.

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#73

Post by bascule »

brown9-2 wrote: post #16

It's useful when discussing this topic to break the word "spy" down into more discrete terms to understand exactly what we are discussing. I found this article to be useful in differentiating the various terms: On its face, the document suggests that the U.S. government regularly collects and stores all domestic telephone records. I use the caveat because there are several ways to interpret it, assuming it is real. (…

We know exactly what's being collected: all the Internet traffic they can get their hands on. They have installed beam splitters on Internet backbones at facilities around the country:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

And are funneling all of the traffic to a datacenter in Utah with "yottabyte" scale capacity, with the goal of having enough capacity to archive the data for 100 years:

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/03/ff_nsadatacenter/al...

The NSA whistleblower who disclosed the project to the public was the person who wrote the backend of the system, which was originally designed for foreign data collection only. The NSA later repurposed the system for domestic data collection too. The goal, according to him, is to build models of every single person in the country, model the social graph, and be able to classify people as potential threats.

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#74

Post by Jauny »

Ziomislaw wrote: post #43
brown9-2 wrote: post #16

It's useful when discussing this topic to break the word "spy" down into more discrete terms to understand exactly what we are discussing. I found this article to be useful in differentiating the various terms: On its face, the document suggests that the U.S. government regularly collects and stores all domestic telephone records. I use the caveat because there are several ways to interpret it, assuming it is real. (…

is the 'reason' even verified? is that not just a pretty way of saying "they can't browse through the data, unless they have a reason - any reason will do - feel secure:) "

"so long as the Attorney General certifies that a particular set of information is useful for reasons of national security. Then, the NSA asks the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court to order that a company comply."

I would assume it would be pretty hard to go through those steps with "any reason", no? I like thinking most people are somewhat honest, and I wouldn't see anyone from Intel. use a 'favor credit' with an AG for some random telephone data.

Am I being too innocent? :)

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#75

Post by ngoel36 »

eli wrote: post #31
JPKab wrote: post #19

My brother worked for years in the intelligence community. One of the common stereotypes within the IC regards the fact that Mormons are heavily overrepresented, for various reasons that involve foreign language skills from mission trips, a reputation for respecting authority, abstinence from drugs/alcohol, family connections, ease of gaining security clearances, etc. The stereotype in the IC regarding Mormons is the…

Utah also has cheap land and really cheap electricity.

Probably why Goldman Sachs is moving a lot of its new hires to Salt Lake

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#76

Post by nwh »

samstave wrote: post #41
alexvr wrote: post #20

Does anyone know how they do this, technically, and to what extent? Does Google just feed them billions of emails, or what? Do they type my name into a form on Amazon.com to get SSH access my EC2 server? And how the hell do they see my finances? Do all of those terms of service agreements say, "By the way, we give your private information to the government without question" ??? At first I thought it didn't matter tha…

Facebook has internal teams and tools used to do searches on activity of users, when law enforcement requests come in FB looks at the request and makes a judgement on whether to comply with it. They supply information such as when and from what IP a user logged in, and can provide user content - however I do not know to what extent they provide it. Nothing gets deleted from FB. So the data is there for a long time -…

> however I do not know to what extent they provide it.

Probably in the same form they do for law enforcement. A little booklet with every photo ever uploaded (deleted or otherwise), every message, location and IP address the user has ever used, every single click they have made in the interface. Seriously.

Here's an example booklet, complete with redactions.

http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/88465177?access_key=key-247...

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#77

Post by ArbitraryCrow »

bascule wrote: post #73
brown9-2 wrote: post #16

It's useful when discussing this topic to break the word "spy" down into more discrete terms to understand exactly what we are discussing. I found this article to be useful in differentiating the various terms: On its face, the document suggests that the U.S. government regularly collects and stores all domestic telephone records. I use the caveat because there are several ways to interpret it, assuming it is real. (…

We know exactly what's being collected: all the Internet traffic they can get their hands on. They have installed beam splitters on Internet backbones at facilities around the country: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A And are funneling all of the traffic to a datacenter in Utah with "yottabyte" scale capacity, with the goal of having enough capacity to archive the data for 100 years: http://www.wired.com/threat…

The goal, according to him, is to build models of every single person in the country, model the social graph, and be able to classify people as potential threats.

Another example of government waste and redundancy. We already have Facebook for this!

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#78

Post by ihsw »

voxmatt wrote: post #4

I'm glad someone posted this. My immediate thought after reading the breaking news about the massive phone surveillance was, "wait, did people not think this was happening?" I'm really not a conspiracy nut, but that Wired article and the NYTimes reporting made it pretty clear that the Gov't is pretty much collecting everything they can get their hands on. Glad to finally see some outrage though. Legitimate question:…

> what's new about what is breaking in the news right now?

That they no longer operate on a cloak-and-dagger basis, and that all three branches (judicial, executive, legislative) are demonstrating an unprecedented level of cooperation -- the "checks and balances" we so hold dear in democracy are now null and void.

Previously, plausible deniability and "neither confirm nor deny" public relations policies dominated the privacy debate arena, however now we can move forward beyond that and we can have a frank and honest discussion about it all.

The window of opportunity to debate these broad-sweeping and baseless violations of privacy is distinctly ajar, however it is closing quickly.

The various levels of government will soon rely quite heavily on this domestic surveillance network and implementing restrictions after the fact is almost always impossible.

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#79

Post by isleyaardvark »

leephillips wrote: post #34
voxmatt wrote: post #4

I'm glad someone posted this. My immediate thought after reading the breaking news about the massive phone surveillance was, "wait, did people not think this was happening?" I'm really not a conspiracy nut, but that Wired article and the NYTimes reporting made it pretty clear that the Gov't is pretty much collecting everything they can get their hands on. Glad to finally see some outrage though. Legitimate question:…

"wait, did people not think this was happening?" There is a very interesting book called The Puzzle Palace , about the early history of the NSA and its forerunners. The telegraph system had ATT cooperating with the government to let them have a copy of everything . This is before telephones. I always assumed this never stopped.

Project SHAMROCK. It ended in 1975 due to the scandals that came to light during Church committee hearings (and Watergate), hearings that resulted in things like FISA and the Congressional select committees on intelligence oversight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_SHAMROCK

Re: Stellar Wind (code name)

#80

Post by regehr »

ngoel36 wrote: post #75
eli wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Utah also has cheap land and really cheap electricity.

Probably why Goldman Sachs is moving a lot of its new hires to Salt Lake

I live in SLC and have met quite a few people over the last few years who lost jobs in the financial sector, usually in the NYC area, and subsequently moved to Utah.
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