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Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

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Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#11
post #4

Is there a way to disable remote access to the doors? Other than driving an old car :)

Yes, you don't mount the mechanism that opens the doors when installing the alarm (or cut the wires afterwards). Store bought alarms have a lot of crap the electrician never hooks up so what's the difference not mounting this one.

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#12

What's the big mystery here? There have been published articles on the ease of hacking car remotes (and even the onboard electronics) going back at least a couple of years. For example: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2011/01... http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/07/hacking_bmws_r... http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20085131-48/remote-unlo... http://news.consumerreports.org/cars/2011/…

If they were using key reprogramming/hacking there's no reason to 'always use' the passenger side front door as claimed in the video. So I don't think it's clear that these thieves are using any of those techniques. I imagine it might be stupider, like maybe there's a way to induce the unlock button or motor to trigger via induction or something. Though I'm pretty poorly informed about that kind of thing scientifical…

If they were using key reprogramming/hacking there's no reason to 'always use' the passenger side front door as claimed in the video.

It's a fair point, but I don't know that I'd take that at face value. That could have just been a subjective assessment that got repeated as fact. Without us having access to the actual videos or the raw numbers, it's hard to say.

So I don't think it's clear that these thieves are using any of those techniques.

Sure, and I'm not saying it's 100% certain that this is exactly how the thieves are operating.. just pointing out that it's well known that modern cars are vulnerable... if there are additional, as yet unreported vulnerabilities, would anybody be surprised?

I imagine it might be stupider, like maybe there's a way to induce the unlock button to trigger via induction or something.

That actually strikes me as semi-reasonable, without having research the matter in any depth. Where were you on the night of January 12th, when a black Suburban was stolen ...

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#13
post #4

Is there a way to disable remote access to the doors? Other than driving an old car :)

You should be able to pull the fuse for the door locks; the mechanical lock buttons and key will continue to work. To find out which fuse, just Google "[car make] [model] [year] fuse diagram" and look for door lock actuators or similar.

Also, most (if not all) car user manuals come with a diagram of the fuse box.

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#14

What's the big mystery here? There have been published articles on the ease of hacking car remotes (and even the onboard electronics) going back at least a couple of years. For example: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2011/01... http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/07/hacking_bmws_r... http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20085131-48/remote-unlo... http://news.consumerreports.org/cars/2011/…

If they were using key reprogramming/hacking there's no reason to 'always use' the passenger side front door as claimed in the video. So I don't think it's clear that these thieves are using any of those techniques. I imagine it might be stupider, like maybe there's a way to induce the unlock button or motor to trigger via induction or something. Though I'm pretty poorly informed about that kind of thing scientifical…

I would assume that they use the passenger side front door because that is where the storage compartment is located.

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#15
Why is this so baffling a shocking? I think we all knew this was possible before anybody actually did it. It's not like their using proper crypto. It's the equivalent of a bad house lock give me some good lock picks and 60 seconds and I'm in so why is this so surprising?

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#16
I was intrigued by their mention of this "Jim Stickley" who was cited as a top security expert. I had never heard of him before, so did a quick search to find out a little more about him. He seems to be a pretty legit and well known security guy[1], but it surprises me that he said:

This is really frustrating because clearly they've figured out something that looks really simple and whatever it is they're doing, it takes just seconds to do," Stickley said. "And you look and you go, 'That should not be possible.

Considering, again, that there has been published research on this topic, and a presentation at Black Hat, revealing that (at least some) cars are vulnerable.

Honestly, I feel like the reporter on this article should have done a bit more background research and interviewed a few more people. Not that it changes the fundamental issue (don't leave valuables in your car, etc.) but it would have been a stronger article with some more context, IMO.

[1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Stickley

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#17

What's the big mystery here? There have been published articles on the ease of hacking car remotes (and even the onboard electronics) going back at least a couple of years. For example: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2011/01... http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/07/hacking_bmws_r... http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20085131-48/remote-unlo... http://news.consumerreports.org/cars/2011/…

If they were using key reprogramming/hacking there's no reason to 'always use' the passenger side front door as claimed in the video. So I don't think it's clear that these thieves are using any of those techniques. I imagine it might be stupider, like maybe there's a way to induce the unlock button or motor to trigger via induction or something. Though I'm pretty poorly informed about that kind of thing scientifical…

If I was a thief then I'd always hit the passenger side front door as it gives me the quickest access to the glove compartment, where valuables are likely to be stored. Not sure what the mystery is here.

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#19

What's the big mystery here? There have been published articles on the ease of hacking car remotes (and even the onboard electronics) going back at least a couple of years. For example: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2011/01... http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/07/hacking_bmws_r... http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20085131-48/remote-unlo... http://news.consumerreports.org/cars/2011/…

Oh, but according to SOMEONE (source for this claim is not given) "That code is encrypted and constantly changing — and should be hackproof." American media at it's best!

How would you describe a challenge based authentication system that uses 128-bit AES? I find the reporter's description reasonable.

Re: Police admit they're 'stumped' by mystery car thefts

#20

What's the big mystery here? There have been published articles on the ease of hacking car remotes (and even the onboard electronics) going back at least a couple of years. For example: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2011/01... http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/07/hacking_bmws_r... http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-20085131-48/remote-unlo... http://news.consumerreports.org/cars/2011/…

If they were using key reprogramming/hacking there's no reason to 'always use' the passenger side front door as claimed in the video. So I don't think it's clear that these thieves are using any of those techniques. I imagine it might be stupider, like maybe there's a way to induce the unlock button or motor to trigger via induction or something. Though I'm pretty poorly informed about that kind of thing scientifical…

And notice they're also touching the door handle with their bare hands. There's probably some sort of exploit dealing with theses vehicles' touch-activated car unlocking feature.
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