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Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

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Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#61

Post by parasubvert »

klibertp wrote: post #58
Sven7 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very easy to say. Politicians are just reflections of who we all are. And imho they have the hardest jobs on the planet today. There isn't a course on Khan Academy, that they can take, which tells them what to do when uncontrolled chain reactions are set off by Social networks. The results will always be messy. And to then say if they just did the "right thing" all will be well, isn't being very realistic. Wh…

Bullshit. Maybe somewhere, in some country - maybe in yours - it's true. In many, many, MANY! (realize this) other countries politicians are a different breed of people, for generations raised in vastly different conditions; they see other things than others, they eat differently, they think in a way that is not comprehensible for many "normal" people in their countries. And that's only a tip of an iceberg, as there…

Anyone whose profession is primarily about influencing others think differently than the rest of the populace (and have a different take on people in general). Sort of like how sex workers think differently about sex, or how chefs think about food.

I didn't read his point your way. I read it as: elected politicians are a reflection of who a society is through the filter of their electoral and media system.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#62

Post by parasubvert »

eatitraw wrote: post #48
jamii wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is substantial evidence that the rate of human violence has decreased dramatically over the course of human history. Two of the biggest turning points were the rise of the nation-state and the spread of democracy. Yes, individual politicians are often corrupt, violent or plain stupid and the political system has serious issues but politicians as a whole have been a boon to civilized society. http://www.amazon.c…

States killed around 200 million people in 20th century. Does your statistics on violence include these victims?

Yes, if you read the book synopsis. All indicators point to violence falling globally.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#63

Post by eatitraw »

parasubvert wrote: post #62
eatitraw wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

States killed around 200 million people in 20th century. Does your statistics on violence include these victims?

Yes, if you read the book synopsis. All indicators point to violence falling globally.

Ok, thanks, I added the book into my to-read list, so I'll read it when I have enough time.

My skepticism isn't unfounded: I remember watching some TED talk(I guess: by the author of this book -- I googled "Steven Pinker ted talk" but I didn't do any additional check). And this talk discussed rates of individual violence(IIRC, murder statistics or something like that), and I was wondering all the time why he excludes organized violence by governments/states in 20th century(and other too).

200 million is a serious number, and it can affect your stats significantly. If you "normalize" this number by year, you'll get 2 millions of people killed on average. 4x times more than individual murder rate: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentiona...

Well, I hope the book is better/clearer than his talk.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#64

Post by _b8r0 »

lutze wrote: post #9

"There is now a menace called the printing press. The best examples of lies can be found there. To me, movable type is the worst menace to society." -- some fucking Pope or other.

To be fair an Ottoman Sultan banned Ottoman script from being printed, effectively banning the printing press across the Ottoman empire and pretty ending the Ottoman golden age, starting it's descent.

The irony of Tayyip Erdogan's Neo-Ottomanist dreams is not lost on me with this statement.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#65

Post by flyinRyan »

Sven7 wrote: post #14
mindcrime wrote: post #7

The actual "biggest threat to society" is politicians.

This is very easy to say. Politicians are just reflections of who we all are. And imho they have the hardest jobs on the planet today. There isn't a course on Khan Academy, that they can take, which tells them what to do when uncontrolled chain reactions are set off by Social networks. The results will always be messy. And to then say if they just did the "right thing" all will be well, isn't being very realistic. Wh…

Hardest job on the planet? You need to take a step back and look how ignorant this statement is. If you fail as a politician what happens? You might get voted out. But even this isn't that big of a deal unless it comes too early in your career, because you should have plenty of cushy jobs lined up from all the companies you've helped in your political career.

Pretty much every other possible job is harder and more risk than being a politician.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#66

Post by flyinRyan »

Sven7 wrote: post #46
X4 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but this is naive and idealistic. Politicians don't work hard and they never will, don't get fooled by the Media. Just because one travels a lot doesn't mean he/she doesn't have enough sleep or that he/she works very hard. It's the opposite!!11 They use your tax money to buy stuff for them and their family. They hire their relatives for "ghost-jobs" and double their salary within the law that they signed t…

Have you managed a team of people?

Yes. The hardest part of it is dealing with boredom that goes with endless meetings and petty politics. In what way do you imagine managing people to be hard work? Because of all the bullshit paperwork you have to fill out?

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#67

Post by flyinRyan »

jamii wrote: post #36
X4 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Upvote!!11 :) Politicians brought the world corruption, violence, massmurder, genocide and they kill our Earth. It will end with us or them, but it needs an end.

There is substantial evidence that the rate of human violence has decreased dramatically over the course of human history. Two of the biggest turning points were the rise of the nation-state and the spread of democracy. Yes, individual politicians are often corrupt, violent or plain stupid and the political system has serious issues but politicians as a whole have been a boon to civilized society. http://www.amazon.c…

This sounds like bullshit on its face. Democracy has existed before now, so what is it about our (largely ineffective if we're honest) democracies that has managed to make the world a safer place?

Also, are you sure there is any correlation at all (assuming these stats are even right)? Couldn't it be that with the rise of nation-state and spread of democracy there was a spread of much better education? Better communication? It could have been any number of things or simply coincidence related to none of them, yet you pick the ones that those in charge would most want us to believe it was.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#68

Post by flyinRyan »

eatitraw wrote: post #48
jamii wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is substantial evidence that the rate of human violence has decreased dramatically over the course of human history. Two of the biggest turning points were the rise of the nation-state and the spread of democracy. Yes, individual politicians are often corrupt, violent or plain stupid and the political system has serious issues but politicians as a whole have been a boon to civilized society. http://www.amazon.c…

States killed around 200 million people in 20th century. Does your statistics on violence include these victims?

Those numbers sound very low to me, actually.

Re: Erdogan says social media 'danger to society'

#70

Post by shmerl »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #52
shmerl wrote: post #6

To Erdogan and co.: https://youtube.com/watch?v=VmffgIqlAYA

That's trashy, nasty, cynical comedy for trashy, nasty, cynical yemanim . Don't post it in here.

Hehe, can't stand the satire? Satire is not forbidden here, you'll live with it. Where is this sick notion coming from, that left-winged are supposed to be big fans of dictators? Go learn some wisdom, left-winged friend. Preferably from Kropotkin.

I find nothing trashy or nasty in making fun of fascists/dictators like these. And there is nothing right-winged in making fun of them.

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