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Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

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Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#131

Post by mattbarrie »

lotharbot wrote: post #98
mattbarrie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well you can always ignore it? There are something things you might like to earn with the credits, for example the phone number for the head of support, a chat with me over skype with a cup of tea, or a t-shirt? It's not like you have to do anything extra.

I wish I could ignore it, but the problem is that it's something my clients have to see too, and it's very prominent . They want to hire me, I want to deliver quality software to them, but in between us is "level up to earn a free T-shirt". Perks and rewards are OK, but the prominence the XP/Badge/level system is given presents a very unprofessional image to potential clients. It's a distraction, a sideshow that's gi…

Clients do not see anything related to your internal freelancer rewards level.

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#132

Post by mattbarrie »

lotharbot wrote: post #98
mattbarrie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well you can always ignore it? There are something things you might like to earn with the credits, for example the phone number for the head of support, a chat with me over skype with a cup of tea, or a t-shirt? It's not like you have to do anything extra.

I wish I could ignore it, but the problem is that it's something my clients have to see too, and it's very prominent . They want to hire me, I want to deliver quality software to them, but in between us is "level up to earn a free T-shirt". Perks and rewards are OK, but the prominence the XP/Badge/level system is given presents a very unprofessional image to potential clients. It's a distraction, a sideshow that's gi…

The only badges they see are exam badges with your score.

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#133

Post by tocomment »

maratd wrote: post #76
wilfra wrote: post #11

elance is good and the only site i use for this - mostly because i'm used to it and i find new sites confusing to get used to, more than that i consider it 'best'. it's dominated by the weak php developers you speak of, but if you just filter everybody out who charges less than $20 per hour[1], you'll get rid of most of them and be left with some good people. after you've gotten a few hundred proposals on elance it w…

> it's dominated by the weak php developers you speak of, but if you just filter everybody out who charges less than $20 per hour[1], you'll get rid of most of them and be left with some good people. As a freelancer who picks up quite a bit of work on Elance, I can vouch for this, from my end of things. The key to success, both on the client side and on the freelance side, is absolutely brutal filtering. There are ma…

Does it pay well? I was under the impression it wasn't viable for developers in high cost of living areas?

Also what do you mean about number 5, rejecting proposals?

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#134

Post by lotharbot »

mattbarrie wrote: post #131
lotharbot wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I could ignore it, but the problem is that it's something my clients have to see too, and it's very prominent . They want to hire me, I want to deliver quality software to them, but in between us is "level up to earn a free T-shirt". Perks and rewards are OK, but the prominence the XP/Badge/level system is given presents a very unprofessional image to potential clients. It's a distraction, a sideshow that's gi…

Clients do not see anything related to your internal freelancer rewards level.

But they see their own level.

We had a client with us on vWorker. When we all transitioned to Freelancer, we thought "great -- lower fees and an easier to use website!" Their first login, they saw all the XP-level stuff and bailed. They simply weren't willing to conduct business on a website that seemed to treat everything like a game.

When you're running a serious business, perception matters. As you can see from this HN thread, some people who made the transition have a negative perception of the confusing, distracting sideshow of the XP system. It wouldn't be so bad if it was phrased in a more neutral way, like "Freelancer rewards". But giving something phrased in game terminology so much prominence is a big turnoff for some of us.

Of course, I don't have access to your internal metrics or split tests. Maybe the terminology works out as a net positive; maybe the people who like it engage enough more to make up for those who left because of it. I can't speak for your entire client base, only my little corner of it. And my little corner of it would be doing more business through Freelancer if the gamey stuff wasn't so prominently featured.

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#135

Post by maratd »

tocomment wrote: post #133
maratd wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's dominated by the weak php developers you speak of, but if you just filter everybody out who charges less than $20 per hour[1], you'll get rid of most of them and be left with some good people. As a freelancer who picks up quite a bit of work on Elance, I can vouch for this, from my end of things. The key to success, both on the client side and on the freelance side, is absolutely brutal filtering. There are ma…

Does it pay well? I was under the impression it wasn't viable for developers in high cost of living areas? Also what do you mean about number 5, rejecting proposals?

> Also what do you mean about number 5, rejecting proposals?

The client has the ability to reject a proposal and move it to the declined pile, where it is hidden from view. The client should exercise that ability at every possible turn to keep the current proposals on the project page to a minimum. Nobody likes dealing with a crowd.

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#136

Post by mgiglesias »

mattbarrie wrote: post #130
mgiglesias wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do have a point. All of us ex-vWorker users had to "put up" with the UI. Of course Freelancer is way better in that aspect. In terms of UX you have a better product than vWorker. However so do pretty much all other platforms. It isn't hard to offer something better than a "horrendous interface" Regarding the feedback transition it indeed went smoothly, minor some glitches (for example one of our ongoing vWorker p…

You don't have to pay for membership. Free accounts have a 10% commission, versus 15% for vworker. Our paid commissions drop this as far as 3%. You were happy moving your clients in to pay 15%?

We paid 12.5% on private projects, 10% on DP.

Free accounts on Freelancer do pay 10% commission. But that's not the only difference. According to your own page (http://www.freelancer.com/membership/) free accounts only offer you 10 bids PER MONTH, 20 skills, 5 portfolio entries (why would you limit a freelancer ability to showcase his quality?)

So yes, I was happy. I personally feel I rather have someone charging me more and provide me a personal service, than pay less and have to pay more to be able to bid. Meritocracy is what should drive your limits upwards, not money.

Re: Ask HN: What Freelancer site do you recommend?

#137

Post by mgiglesias »

jf22 wrote: post #128
mgiglesias wrote: post #8

I've been the top #1 provider for years and up until vWorker got sold to freelancer. I honestly think that was an awful move, since what made vWorker different from the rest is that it had less number of providers (and clients), but with a much better quality. This, and the fact that being a freelancer for years helped me identify lots of things that were poorly done on sites such as freelancer, made me realize that…

Why are the stock photos on your main page of white people?

We use lots of photos, check our social profiles. Best.
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