Saw title and was expecting to see something about the miserable state of touch support.
Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
121–130 of 178 posts
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
From System.Fundamentals.Firmware.FirmwareSupportsUSBDevices: The USB controller and USB devices must be fully enumerated when: * Anything other than the Windows Boot Manager is at the top of the system boot order. * A boot next variable has been set to boot to something other than the Windows Boot Manager. * On a system where the Windows Boot Manager is at the top of the list, an error case has been hit, such that t…
Does this mean that the hardware is pretty much guaranteed to boot slower if not booting Windows too, in order to do USB initialisation, even when not going to the boot screen?
Apparently, yes, which is something I hadn't noticed before.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
As TFA notes, this may involve repeated resets during boot, added hardware and a whole lot of steps my mother wouldn't take. She'd just be coerced to use Windows.
I find it hard to believe that there are a lot of people who are tech savvy enough to be able to install, partition disks and configure Linux and bootloader on a Windows 7 machine, but are suddenly unable to turn off one setting in the BIOS setup on a Windows 8 machine. And to enable them, we need to make every Windows PC insecure by default and leave hundreds of millions of people vulnerable to undetectable bootkit…
There are lots of Linux distributions (for instance, Ubuntu) that makes all of that very simple. Some of them will even install inside of a Windows partition, or resize it for you.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
I paid money for Windows 8 when I bought my Dell Dell almost certainly preloaded some software in exchange for compensation that almost certainly exceeded what Dell paid for their Windows license. Even ignoring the testing, support and return issues people usually bring up, Dell probably couldn't sell the computer for a lower price with no OS or a free OS without losing money. In short, third parties effectively paid…
Dell probably couldn't sell the computer for a lower price with no OS or a free OS without losing money I find this hard to believe, even when considering all the mechanisms you mentioned. Do you have any evidence for this very counter-intuitive hypothesis? IOW: Citation needed
What is counter intuitive about:
1) companies paying to have their software preinstalled on a laptop
2) the previously mentioned companies software only working on windows
To me this seems like one of the, if not the most, plausible explanation for windows systems being cheaper than Ubuntu
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#125My motherboard is Windows 8 certified and my USB keyboard works perfectly fine during boot. Additionally you can get Windows 8 to give you more boot options if you just keep rebooting while it is trying to start up. Eventually it will give up and attempt to repair your computer before asking what you want to do next. Has anyone experienced the problems described in the article actually in practice or is the article p…
The requirements only apply to systems that are Windows 8 certified, not individual components. If you built your system then it may support Fast Boot but not have it enabled out of the box. Motherboard manufacturers are unlikely to turn it on by default because it requires you to have a graphics card with a UEFI option ROM rather than a traditional VGA BIOS, and there's something of a chicken and egg problem in turning it off if you're using an older card.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes. USB init won't happen until the Windows kernel starts.
I find that very hard to believe atleast based off my experience. How else are you supposed to do USB boot ups? Almost all OS I installed recently has been through USB Drives and not to mention I use a USB keyboard to key into the BIOS.
If the system is configured to boot off USB then the firmware will do full USB initialisation. To get into the firmware, you choose the option from the Windows 8 shutdown menu.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#127It shouldn't take all that long to set up USB. Getting the host controller running is probably a few hundred microseconds of initialization. After that, it's all about enumerating hubs and finding devices; there isn't much there that requires delays. You're probably gated by the firmware on the keyboard.
I imagine the USB stacks are full of paranoid "let things settle for 200ms" sleeps that make more crappy devices work, or that give external HDDs time to spin up. I'll bet you could remove those if all you care about is a keyboard.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#128FWIW, As a lawyer, I have a lot of trouble believing that assent to a contract you can't avoid, done specifically for the purpose of removing the contracted software, would ever be held to bind you to the terms and conditions of that contract. In fact, i'd go so far as to say that if Microsoft ever actually tried to enforce, it would run them into serious regulatory trouble. If push came to shove, i'm sure they would…
> In fact, i'd go so far as to say that if Microsoft ever actually tried to enforce, it would run them into serious regulatory trouble. And Microsoft probably knows this, and would avoid it at all costs. But having an overly broad EULA helps them push around the n00b Linux installer who doesn't know any better.
And the big corporation with too much to lose to feel safe rolling the dice even on a sure thing.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
I paid money for Windows 8 when I bought my Dell Dell almost certainly preloaded some software in exchange for compensation that almost certainly exceeded what Dell paid for their Windows license. Even ignoring the testing, support and return issues people usually bring up, Dell probably couldn't sell the computer for a lower price with no OS or a free OS without losing money. In short, third parties effectively paid…
Dell probably couldn't sell the computer for a lower price with no OS or a free OS without losing money I find this hard to believe, even when considering all the mechanisms you mentioned. Do you have any evidence for this very counter-intuitive hypothesis? IOW: Citation needed
Which part is counter-intuitive?
A windows license costs Dell $X. Each trial software they preload earns Dell $Y.
If they preload enough stuff, the sum of the $Y amounts can exceed $X.
Re: Secure Boot isn't the only problem facing Linux on Windows 8 hardware
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
A EULA is a legal document, it can contain myriad of terms. Indeed, most EULAs bind you to future as-yet-disclosed terms as well. That's no small thing.
Most EULAs cannot validly bind consumers to future as-yet-disclosed terms. As above, in this specific situation, where you are agreeing because that is the only way to effectively remove the software, i have trouble seeing any court holding you to those terms. If you were trying to get around agreeing to the license but still using windows 8, sure.
Going to court at all is a loss. Why should I have to risk having to pay for a lawyer and take time out of my day to convince a judge that I shouldn't be bound to the terms.