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Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

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Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#61

The fundamental error of this piece is that it assumes that if you vote Democratic, you're by definition not a one-percenter. But this is just wrong. There are lots of one-percenters who vote Democratic. They just mostly feel more strongly about cultural-liberalism issues than they do about economic ones. But when it comes to economic issues, these folks still tend to lean rightward; they overestimate the degree of s…

The fundamental error of this piece is that it assumes that if you vote Democratic, you're by definition not an engineer. (not really, but to me it makes as much sense as your statement)

How does being a part of the evil "one percent" make you any less qualified to have or hold a variety of political views? If anything, I've found that having more money makes me more aware of issues like unemployment, health care, etc because many of my friends and family are not as well off, and now I'm in a position where I feel obligated to do something about it.

Overall, I find the whole left/right political divide to be frustratingly counter-productive. Both sides are wrong, and we waste much time and energy arguing about which side is more wrong.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#62
post #18
post #3

This article conflates Libertarians with Republicans which I don't think makes sense in Silicon Valley. Yes, nationwide they tend to be in the same group but not in the valley. Judging from comments on HN the valley does sound quite libertarian but not the kind that register and vote Republican. It seems more intellectual and based in logic while Republicans are more about dogma and scoring political points.

Little "l" libertarianism has always had a tense relationship with the Republican party. Certain parts of the libertarian philosophy are certainly incorporated within the conservative philosophy espoused by many Republicans, but the GOP has always been a large tent party (like the Democrats) which includes numerous groups that believe many different things that often disagree with each other. But attempting to have a…

> Little "l" libertarianism has always had a tense relationship with the Republican party

It gets even more complicated when you look inside the party. On one hand you have the "Tea Party" Representatives and Senators elected in the last couple of election cycles. Most of them swing towards little "l" libertarianism (at least fiscally if not socially). Recently, the Republican leadership in the House "fired" most of them from their committee assignments because they won't hold "the party line". The current Republican leadership talks a small government game, but isn't very interested in it. It is rhetoric and not action.

If the scale tips into the "Tea Party" favor (lot of interesting primary action), then I can see actual libertarianism (more fiscal than social) having a home, otherwise I expect the 2016 Presidential primary and convention to be epically nasty. The 2012 convention was a screw the local folks type of affair, but I get the feeling the local folks are gearing for 2016.

> But attempting to have a nuanced discussion of politics in this country is as pointless as it is impossible.

My only comfort in this area is that at least some of things that were said by candidates about other candidates in the election of 1800 cannot be said now.

On the other hand, punditry (by both sides) is just as profitable as it ever was as a spectator sport.

note: For those interested in a deeper look at such things. Look at the build up to the 2014 South Dakota Senatorial race. The amount of non-local manipulation reminds me more of national party bosses than a normal primary season. It might be a bit of an indicator of what is to come for both parties.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#63
I think the Valley's insane wealth is a temporary thing, indicative of a comparatively new industry.

Detroit once had the highest average income in the United States. Cars are still as popular as ever, but the auto industry eventually shifted and diversified and broadened and left Detroit mostly behind.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#64
Guaranteed every Republican gives more to charity then every Democrat.

Jesus criticized those who give publically -- If a Democrat gives to charity he makes a big deal out of it because he's not like a church-goer who sees everybody doing it.

All these people have built their houses on sand. I'm marveling at what is in store one of these years when they discover God.

God says...

shall they hear without a preacher? 10:15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

10:18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

10:19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

10:20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#65
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fundamental error of this piece is that it assumes that if you vote Democratic, you're by definition not a one-percenter. What? Much of the article is devoted to making the opposite point: that the SV elite overwhelmingly support the Democrats.

Political affiliation seems like a red herring in a two party system. It wouldn't surprise me if people in SV vote democrat because they don't like certain things associated with the republicans (religion , anti-gay rights, guns , whatever) rather than agreeing wholesale with the democratic party manifesto.

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Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#66
post #25
post #3

This article conflates Libertarians with Republicans which I don't think makes sense in Silicon Valley. Yes, nationwide they tend to be in the same group but not in the valley. Judging from comments on HN the valley does sound quite libertarian but not the kind that register and vote Republican. It seems more intellectual and based in logic while Republicans are more about dogma and scoring political points.

Conflating libertarians with Republicans doesn't make sense anywhere. The simplified definition I give people who ask me what a libertarian is is "someone who is economically conservative but socially liberal." The conventional "Republican = conservative, Democrat = liberal" model of American politics casts a vector quantitiy as a scalar.

>> "someone who is economically conservative but socially liberal."

I don't feel like that defines a libertarian at all.

When I hear the word, I think of someone who believes they (and everyone) should have the right to do whatever they like - so long as it does not infringe on anyone else's freedoms or rights.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#67
post #45
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention that there's a line of reasoning for 1%ers to support the democratic party's centrist economic policies in the name of self-interest -- richer consumers to buy stuff means more sales for those selling it, better infrastructure is good for business, etc. Some might disagree with that reasoning but it's really missing the mark to consider rich democrats as some sort of 'self hating rich' or 'culture vote…

Or even that the Democratic party isn't a creature of finance. Since Wall Street has largely captured both parties, a plutocrat can vote on social issues without worrying overmuch about their pocketbook.

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Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#68

One foundation of the entire argument seems to be that support for the Democratic party makes SV progressive. However, in a global context only the minority left wing of the Democratic party could be called progressive. Also, a simpler explanation for the large support for the Democrats would be that SV consists of intelligent, highly educated and well-informed people that wouldn't dream of supporting the extremist,…

Yea, in real terms the Democratic party are more right wing than the UK Conservative party.

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#69
post #43

> True libertarians would be repulsed at the thought, but the success of Silicon Valley even suggests that governments could do much more to encourage these kinds of internal compensation structures, in the name of better business and social cohesion. (Not to mention old-fashioned fairness.) Wait, what part did the government play in how tech-companies compensate their employees fairly? Or does he mean the government…

The author appears to intend that latter meaning, where SV companies have more egalitarian ownership structures on their own, but that now that we've seen the results, the government should encourage those structures more broadly in the economy.

Actually, the government plays a small part already in how high-tech companies share equity with employees, through preferential tax treatment for Incentive Stock Options. You could imagine many such nudges that could be employed to expand capital ownership short of distributing equity to employees "by force".

Remember in general that the limited-liability corporation as an institutional type is itself a creation of government - the notion of a business as a separate entity with distributed owners such that the business can go bankrupt without allowing creditors to go after the non-business assets of the stockholders is an artificial and relatively modern invention with a large and complicated legal structure buttressing it. C Corporations, LLCs, LLPs, PCs and the like are all creations of government and the way they operate in practice is non-trivially shaped by the ways those laws are structured. Is it so outlandish to imagine an alternative form with a deliberately egalitarian bias (an "E Corp"?). It only takes one state experimenting to make it a reality!

Re: Why Silicon Valley is not the second coming of the Gilded Age

#70
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for reminding me again why I'm not in The Valley. Seems to me the place has become a very trendy echo chamber, more of a hot fashion and marketing center than a center of innovation or creativity.

FWIW, I've found it to be a hotbed of creativity and innovation, >and< a hotbed of flash-in-the-pan douchbaggery, if that's what you seek that out. The stupidity is easy to avoid.

Yes, exactly. While there are a plenty of hucksters and faux-glamorous hangers-on, there is also an enormous amount of real work being done, both at quiet little startups too busy making something great to bother with publicity, and at large companies, where the engineering talent is sometimes so great that people don’t even notice that it’s there.
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