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What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

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Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#91
post #84
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and so imho this increases your turnaround time for changes unless you are a real wizard with your tools, which is certainly possible

You don't have to be a wizard, just competent.

if you want to compare yourself to someone competent with an IDE, you better be a wizard

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#92
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this post highly questionable. What is so hairy about C++ for an IDE exactly? It's strongly typed and yes, if you do too much C style stuff it may be a bit harder to navigate but if you stay in a clean OO world it should be very, very similar to Java. Microsoft put out a competent C++ IDE well over a decade ago and Borland has done so as well... It's my personal opinion that IDEs are in general superior to tex…

To write a good C++ IDE, you need to deal with macros, C++'s obscene syntax (There are what- four complete C++ parsers?), and you need to parse all sorts of Makefiles, or else no existing projects will work.

I'd expect some games that had to be played with release engineering. If the code is properly modularized, this could be two separate processes where you develop your module with mock data and then deploy it into production. Is the opinion really that all the current IDEs suck - http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualc/default.aspx , http://www.eclipse.org/cdt/ , http://www.netbeans.org/features/cpp/ , http://www.bloodshed.net/devcpp.html and all the 2nd tier as well? Maybe I am too deep into Java and eclipse, but it seems there are genuine advantages to using IDEs and C++ is similar enough to java that at least for some subset, such a tool could be created. If not, that certainly seems like a market...

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#93
post #91
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to be a wizard, just competent.

if you want to compare yourself to someone competent with an IDE, you better be a wizard

I think you're overestimating the difficulty of developing on the command line.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#94
post #93
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you want to compare yourself to someone competent with an IDE, you better be a wizard

I think you're overestimating the difficulty of developing on the command line.

I'm really not. I've done both. IDEs were created because they make it more efficient to write code, do you really think this whole line of technological development was a mistake? Even a 10-20% decrease in time on average is huge.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#95
post #14
post #2

This is a nice list! However, I really think that increasing speed of development with better tools is a cornerstone of being one of those elite programmers, and vim<<eclipse, at least for Java! I haven't done C/C++ for some time... but I expected similar IDEs exist. "The way our development environment is set up though, there was really no good way to use Eclipse because everything is done on a remote development bo…

Unfortunately, your expectations would not be met. IDEs make up for their limited text-editing features by providing language-dependent, code-aware functionality. Because C++ is such a hairy language, IDEs aren't able to do much with it. They don't give you anything like the cushy, comprehensive support that IDEs provide for Java. With C++, giving up the relatively lame IDE features to get a powerful text editor is a…

Clearly spoken by someone who's never seen Visual Studio.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#96
post #94
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're overestimating the difficulty of developing on the command line.

I'm really not. I've done both. IDEs were created because they make it more efficient to write code, do you really think this whole line of technological development was a mistake? Even a 10-20% decrease in time on average is huge.

I think they were originally created for environments like Windows where the basic development tools weren't part of a normal operating system install.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#97
post #96
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really not. I've done both. IDEs were created because they make it more efficient to write code, do you really think this whole line of technological development was a mistake? Even a 10-20% decrease in time on average is huge.

I think they were originally created for environments like Windows where the basic development tools weren't part of a normal operating system install.

I have no idea of why they were created, Windows certainly was the front-runner for GUI stuff. I worked at my first job doing java dev with emacs and I've been fully working on linux for the last several years and I still find eclipse to be superior. Maybe it is because the learning curve is lower and my emacs environment was never setup properly, but I think the OSGi framework (dependency management standard in eclipse) is genuinely useful and I love having everything I need in one program. I still find myself writing sed/awk/bash scripts occasionally, but my workflow in my IDE with mylyn integrated to bugzilla and SVN is just so much faster...

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#98
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To write a good C++ IDE, you need to deal with macros, C++'s obscene syntax (There are what- four complete C++ parsers?), and you need to parse all sorts of Makefiles, or else no existing projects will work.

I'd expect some games that had to be played with release engineering. If the code is properly modularized, this could be two separate processes where you develop your module with mock data and then deploy it into production. Is the opinion really that all the current IDEs suck - http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualc/default.aspx , http://www.eclipse.org/cdt/ , http://www.netbeans.org/features/cpp/ , http://www.bloo…

C++ does look similar to Java, but it's really not. Preprocessor magic + template magic + linking magic means pain.

I will admit to not having tried devc++ or visualc. I would imagine that visualc might be able to solve the problem, since they can control the build system, and can hook into their compiler directly (last I checked, GCC made this very hard).

I'm also going to go out on a limb and suggest that you may be overestimating the pain points other people experience /not/ using an IDE.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#99
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd expect some games that had to be played with release engineering. If the code is properly modularized, this could be two separate processes where you develop your module with mock data and then deploy it into production. Is the opinion really that all the current IDEs suck - http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualc/default.aspx , http://www.eclipse.org/cdt/ , http://www.netbeans.org/features/cpp/ , http://www.bloo…

C++ does look similar to Java, but it's really not. Preprocessor magic + template magic + linking magic means pain. I will admit to not having tried devc++ or visualc. I would imagine that visualc might be able to solve the problem, since they can control the build system, and can hook into their compiler directly (last I checked, GCC made this very hard). I'm also going to go out on a limb and suggest that you may b…

I haven't done professional work in C++ only my thesis project which was relatively self contained and simple, so maybe I am underestimating the importance of preprocessor/template/linking magic. There is certainly a rather large barrier to entry for vim/emacs for the average developer.

Re: What I Wish I Had Known About Developing C/C++ From Linux Before I Started

#100
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd expect some games that had to be played with release engineering. If the code is properly modularized, this could be two separate processes where you develop your module with mock data and then deploy it into production. Is the opinion really that all the current IDEs suck - http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualc/default.aspx , http://www.eclipse.org/cdt/ , http://www.netbeans.org/features/cpp/ , http://www.bloo…

C++ does look similar to Java, but it's really not. Preprocessor magic + template magic + linking magic means pain. I will admit to not having tried devc++ or visualc. I would imagine that visualc might be able to solve the problem, since they can control the build system, and can hook into their compiler directly (last I checked, GCC made this very hard). I'm also going to go out on a limb and suggest that you may b…

I decided to put up a poll about this http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=574697 maybe enough people will answer to be interesting?
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