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Google App Engine finally supports PHP

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Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#31

Post by flixic »

gngeal wrote: post #25
flixic wrote: post #2

They seem to twist the facts ever so slightly. PHP is not "most popular computing language on the planet", it's the most popular web coding language; C is the most popular "computing" language, whatever that means. And in linked article they make it seem that PhoneGap apps are more native than they are, "built-in PhoneGap integration so developers can publish native app packages to the various app stores". Not factua…

I'd say that Java is the most popular one, but C does all the hard work!

Oh, yes, you are totally right. For some reason I mixed these rankings in my mind.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#32

Post by hugorodgerbrown »

jrockway wrote: post #8

Google App Engine was almost a science project for the first few years, only supporting languages that Google used internally. Python?

I'm pretty sure that the original scraping scripts that Larry Page and Sergey Brin worked on (before Google was called Google) were written in Python. (Although I can't find the reference I read about that, so could be mistaken.)

[UPDATE] According to Wikipedia (judge for yourself), Larry Page is quoted as saying:

    "BackRub is written in Java and Python and runs
    on several Sun Ultras and Intel Pentiums running Linux."
, back in 1996 whilst he was still at Stanford (Backrub being the original project name).

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#33

Post by PommeDeTerre »

shocks wrote: post #30
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing "snobbish" about pointing out serious technological flaws in a given programming language or application. This is especially true when those flaws have no justifiable reason for existing in the first place, or when they can compromise the security of data and other systems.

Right, but it doesn't need to be pointed out by 100 people every single time the language comes up in conversation. PHP has its place. HNs typical "PHP LOL OMFG WTF SHIT" reaction is childish.

Such flaws should be pointed out whenever possible by however many people feel like pointing them out.

I think that the skilled members of any community or industry have a duty to stand against technology that is inherently broken. This is quite distant from being "childish". In fact, it's a sign of maturity when one can unemotionally analyze a given tool and deem it to be of an insufficient quality for practical use.

And the "typical reaction" is absolutely nothing like you suggest. Time and time again I see well-reasoned, objective analysis which clearly points out the numerous negative facts about PHP. The problem does not lie with those who express these facts, but rather with those who, for whatever reason, cannot or will not accept them.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#34

Post by sbarre »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #29
Killswitch wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We get it, you don't like PHP. Move on already.

No, it's good for people to be extremely vocal about technologies riddled with serious flaws. It's unfortunate, but ultimately beneficial, even when they have to do this repeatedly. It doesn't matter if we're talking about PHP or JavaScript, or a web framework like Ruby on Rails, or various NoSQL databases, or even certain operating systems. Even if people have used such technologies with some degree of success in th…

Except his two-line post didn't actually say anything other than a long-winded version of "PHP sucks!" and that gets really old really fast...

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#35

Post by rbanffy »

shocks wrote: post #30
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing "snobbish" about pointing out serious technological flaws in a given programming language or application. This is especially true when those flaws have no justifiable reason for existing in the first place, or when they can compromise the security of data and other systems.

Right, but it doesn't need to be pointed out by 100 people every single time the language comes up in conversation. PHP has its place. HNs typical "PHP LOL OMFG WTF SHIT" reaction is childish.

> PHP has its place.

Agreed. It's possible to make good, elegant and fast PHP code. Unfortunately, most of it is not. I would never advise anyone to start a new project with it mostly because of its many design flaws. Also, the App Engine environment negates PHP's biggest advantage: ubiquity. You just cannot deploy a PHP App Engine application on most PHP hosting providers unless you deny your app the App Engine runtime environment.

edit: burn, karma, burn.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#36

Post by Kiro »

I am no hardcore programmer and PHP is perfect for me. Tbh I haven't encountered one single bad thing about it during my 5 years programming, although I understand there are major flaws in it. What I'm saying is that for most people PHP works completely fine and is as good as anything.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#37

Post by sbarre »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #33
shocks wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but it doesn't need to be pointed out by 100 people every single time the language comes up in conversation. PHP has its place. HNs typical "PHP LOL OMFG WTF SHIT" reaction is childish.

Such flaws should be pointed out whenever possible by however many people feel like pointing them out. I think that the skilled members of any community or industry have a duty to stand against technology that is inherently broken. This is quite distant from being "childish". In fact, it's a sign of maturity when one can unemotionally analyze a given tool and deem it to be of an insufficient quality for practical use…

Hey this is like your 4th reply on this thread justifying the PHP hate, except I'm not sure you realize that you are backing up junk posts that have no substance beyond "PHP sucks!".

If you feel that strongly about the problems, perhaps you should expand on them?

All languages have pitfalls and problems, and the more popular the language, the more likely that people will succumb to those problems. We get it.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#38

Post by Killswitch »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #29
Killswitch wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We get it, you don't like PHP. Move on already.

No, it's good for people to be extremely vocal about technologies riddled with serious flaws. It's unfortunate, but ultimately beneficial, even when they have to do this repeatedly. It doesn't matter if we're talking about PHP or JavaScript, or a web framework like Ruby on Rails, or various NoSQL databases, or even certain operating systems. Even if people have used such technologies with some degree of success in th…

Except nobody jumps in for a karma train of circle jerking each other about flaws in Python, Ruby or anything else.. Just PHP... Because it's the new cool hip thing to do.. Bash PHP... If you don't, then you won't get high fives from the rest of your hipster friends.

I've been writing PHP for 12 years... I've learned that its got flaws... Just like anything else... I've gotten over it... Why? Because I actually enjoy writing PHP. And nothing you or anybody else can say will change that, so just get over it. Use what's best for you, not what is the new hip thing to use.

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#39

Post by danbruc »

sbarre wrote: post #34
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's good for people to be extremely vocal about technologies riddled with serious flaws. It's unfortunate, but ultimately beneficial, even when they have to do this repeatedly. It doesn't matter if we're talking about PHP or JavaScript, or a web framework like Ruby on Rails, or various NoSQL databases, or even certain operating systems. Even if people have used such technologies with some degree of success in th…

Except his two-line post didn't actually say anything other than a long-winded version of "PHP sucks!" and that gets really old really fast...

The text between the lines was supposed to read as »I would have preferred if Google had not added support for PHP and it would have been way cooler if they had build something as easy as PHP but without insanity«. Okay, that's just an opinion but what else should a comment on a simple fact like »Google App Engine finally supports PHP« be?

Re: Google App Engine finally supports PHP

#40

Post by bink-lynch »

obviouslygreen wrote: post #13
markdown wrote: post #3

I like this just for the fact that it means GAE is here to stay. They're going hard on App Engine, and I'll take that as a win even for python-heads like me.

I definitely wouldn't take this for granted. All it means is that, right now, there are internal resources dedicated to improving the platform's language support. Those that make this largely unsupported assumption will be the most irate and in the worst position if Google drops the platform at some point (not to mention this platform is horrible in terms of proprietary lock in).

I too was concerned about lock in; however, it is really not that bad. I have been on AppEngine from the moment they supported Java. I created an abstraction layer between my program logic and whatever services it uses. This has allowed me to take the exact same compiled jars and run them on AppEngine using the datastore for persistence or in some other servlet container using SQL Server for persistence.

Just one additional advantage of using this approach is that I can use text files for testing and the program logic doesn't know the difference.

That's how I got rid of the lock in issue.

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