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Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

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Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#121
If you don't respect your co-founders then you need to either address the fundamental interpersonal issues or quit. Everything else is an excuse.

If you choose the former, it should start with a frank but non-confrontational conversation among all of you where you discuss what is and isn't working with your relationship. Don't overfocus on the business. The day-to-day of a startup grows from the relationship among the co-founders. That's always at the root.

For example, if the business model isn't working, why don't you have a relationship where you can say "Guys, this business model isn't working. We have to do something different. Let's figure this out."? Over-focusing on the business will result in a laundry-list conversation when everyone just unloads their grievances all at once. It's not productive.

If going into the conversation you feel the urge to let your co-founders "have a piece of your mind" then don't have the conversation. You need to be calm, in control, and aware of the real source of your own frustrations.

Most likely there's a long series of missed-but-unstated expectations, both big and small. You have to acknowledge your own responsibility in this situation, viz., as a co-founder you have a responsibility to bring these up the second they happen to avoid a "blow up" situation. Yet here you are, in just such a situation. You're partially responsible for that, whether your co-founders are actually idiots or not.

You have to be prepared for your co-founders to feel similarly about you. Avoid the trap of allowing the conversation to become a tit for tat. "You forgot to publish that blog post." "Yeah, well, you forgot to follow up with a potential investor!" etc.

It might help to reframe this conversation from one where you're going to tell them all the things that aren't working to one where you ask for help with the things you think aren't working. If you don't want your co-founders to be defensive then you need to be vulnerable -- probably much more vulnerable than you're comfortable being.

Good luck. Welcome to startups.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#123
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree totally but i will add one more option based on this quote "I believe in our product, but I don't believe in our business model." If this is the case and assuming u have nailed a customer pain point down since its been 15 months, i would suggest that you leave and execute the same idea with the business model you believe will work. If you and the VC are on the same page and these guys don't have much tech exp…

It seems like you would be opening yourself up to lawsuits if you take this course of action and are successful. Not that I might not do it if I believed in something, but I'd want to be very careful. If you're out of money it might be hard to pull this off as I've heard seeking funding is a full time job (or two, as your cofounders have shown) so the product has to be mostly good to go (for at least the time being)…

and these are also family members. Doing business with family can be very tricky, let alone when you try to create competition with your own family...

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#124
Don't get emotional about sunk costs - It happens because we are all human, but will not benefit you.

Take a small break - Focus on the present parameters, analyze all your options (other than giving up), give it a fresh look. One can make very bad decisions when emotionally compromised.

Be honest with your co-founders, and it seems that you haven't been speaking to them candidly.

Ask for a salary and set a deadline for them and for yourself. Beyond that just leave. I would not expect a market-linked salary at a startup , but I would definitely not like to work for free or with a salary that makes me struggle with my basic financial requirement.

Remember, you made an investment - in terms of time and effort - Calculate the financial value of the time you spent (like what you would have got in an average job otherwise). Check if you are getting fair enough equity - for all your investment

You feel like "giving up", but if you have to do that, do it gracefully - give it very detailed attention, Work out all options in a comfortable timeline - and may be then if still doesnt look good - leave.

Believe me, "i gave up" will stay with you for your lifetime, if you din't try all the other options before that.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#125
Have you considered freelancing ? It may provides a salary, with enough free time to keep going on the project without having to sacrifice your free time. You may also learn from it the basic of business, which can help understand or argue with your cofounders.

This would send a clear message to them, too : your project is not my main one anymore because I can't get a living from it, and you're about to loose me.

You can then put a stop on new features building and only focus on bug fixing, until actual money is raised.

If they finally succeed, you can easily stop freelancing. And if they don't, you will have made contacts that make it easier to find a new job not on the corporate side.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#126
I've been in a similar situation.

Go be an employee at a startup that's a real business. A real business is a business that's established enough to pay you a fair salary and benefits.

It should be a job that you enjoy, and similar enough to what you're working on now that you can apply your experience. The people in charge should be businessmen who understand that cash needs to flow in order for this to be a real business.

At this point, you've worked with clowns long enough to know how to weed them out. During your job search, a lot of clowns will try to justify not paying you a decent salary. You've already been there, and know that a business that can't pay you isn't a real business.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#127
I really feel for you situation, and I would love to help by chatting. I've been involved in many different startups, from working with friends on no salary, to our current $12 mm series-A endeavor. I've seen tons of startups rise and fall, all sorts, and I think I may be able to lend some advice or just be a sounding board.

Please send me an email if you're interested: carter@gameclosure.com.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#128
This is perfectly normal feeling and reaction: you just have an exceptionally long nerve. Many people would've quit from the dysfunctional culture much earlier.

You either own enough of the company so that you can decide to do things your way or you start demanding paychecks.

You make it or you break it, and when you're no longer so sure then it's the latter.

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#129
Everyone seems to be talking about "sunk cost" here. But it seems like you're working on a product that believe in. Is it possible for you to disrupt the company's current trajectory and try to get things onto a better course?

If your co-founders are doing things wrong, perhaps you can do some research into their side of things and figure out how to do things better. Teach them things, and learn together. Do their jobs for them if you have to. Since they are family, perhaps they will be easier to persuade?

Re: Ask HN: I'm lost. Please help

#130
I am in an almost identical situation myself and can empathise.

I came to the realisation that

* I no longer enjoy what I am doing * I'm not particularly happy * Going into the office is now a chore * I can't see a future where I am at the moment.

Once I realised all of these things - it took a few months - alarm bells started going off. I have now started to make steps to change my situation:

* Seen my Lawyer * Written and dispensed my resume * Spoken to friends about jobs.

I'm now much more comfortable, knowing that I can survive without the company and will probably be much better off without it.

I quite liked the following articles: http://westonmcbride.com/blog/2013/05/06/why-i-abandoned-my-... http://harj.posthaven.com/co-founder-breakups http://jamesmaskell.co.uk/2013/how-to-get-a-job-after-startu...

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