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Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

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Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#41
post #33
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about agenda setting. Media coverage determines what gets covered and what not. Scandals like these make government's ongoing privacy intrusion a real, tangible issue. If I go around spreading the gospel, I am just an internet tinfoil head. If it is the headline on a national newspaper, it is a real issue that needs discussion.

You seem to be assuming the direction of causation there. Not that you're wrong, necessarily, but you never can be sure.

Well, it is certainly bi-directional. Probably we can settle for the good old echo-chamber description. :)

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#42

Let's not forget the IRS having authority to pull all electronic communications from an entity without any kind of oversight at all (because they are a "special" agency) and now word that some of the documents they've been pulling, perhaps against policy, were leaked to the press. I tried to post an analysis of why the IRS story was important to hackers everywhere earlier. It was killed. Beats me why. Some wag said i…

As far as I can tell, there was no real "intercept" in this case other than the government asking for records of calls. So the software involved was probably just a SQL query. That said, I do agree with the point you're making that there can be a larger context to our work. Indeed, it can give meaning to our work. I don't begrudge anyone who enjoys writing iPhone apps; but the prevalence of things like Stuxnet, and C…

Just an SQL query? Maybe they should be charged for hacking under CFAA, then.

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#43
post #13

Maybe my memory's failing me, but I can't think of a similarly-sized press surveillance operation by the Bush Administration. Keep in mind that under Obama, more alleged government leakers have been prosecuted than all of his predecessors combined: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-18/obama-pursuing-leak... This includes administrations that oversaw such problematic eras as the Cold War, the Vietnam War, the McCa…

"Maybe my memory's failing me, but I can't think of a similarly-sized press surveillance operation by the Bush Administration."

Read up on Mark Klein's whistleblower case. It wasn't just press surveillance - it was the origin of surveillance of everybody.

http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/04/70619

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#44
post #38
post #13

Maybe my memory's failing me, but I can't think of a similarly-sized press surveillance operation by the Bush Administration. Keep in mind that under Obama, more alleged government leakers have been prosecuted than all of his predecessors combined: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-18/obama-pursuing-leak... This includes administrations that oversaw such problematic eras as the Cold War, the Vietnam War, the McCa…

We have a problem here and it is not any particular politician or political party but the assumption of almost unlimited power by our entire political leadership. They appear to believe they can do whatever they can get away with - just do it in secret or buried in an incomprehensible law or regulation. And in the rare instance our nepotistic press tries to hold them to account they simply deny and delay and deny and…

"but most of all don't become too cozy with our leadership."

News has become a celebrity sport, and it's too late for "too cozy".

https://www.google.com/search?q=washington+correspondents+di...

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#45
post #3

This- to put it mildly- is Not Good. I'll quote David Carr's tweet[1],which best sums up my feelings on the matter: Lemme see, IRS going after political opponents plus DOJ tapping AP reporters. Nixonian optics on "the most transparent admin in history." I do wonder what kind of a legacy the Obama administration will leave to history when these kinds of events are stacked up. [1] https://twitter.com/carr2n/status/3340…

If you're making a list of the most tyrannical Presidents ever, you'd have to put FDR near the top of that. And his reputation has survived.

Obama is a progressive. So are history professors. His legacy will be fine.

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#46
post #29
post #13

Maybe my memory's failing me, but I can't think of a similarly-sized press surveillance operation by the Bush Administration. Keep in mind that under Obama, more alleged government leakers have been prosecuted than all of his predecessors combined: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-18/obama-pursuing-leak... This includes administrations that oversaw such problematic eras as the Cold War, the Vietnam War, the McCa…

This was an interesting argument, so I did some quick research. Apparently, six (6) Espionage Act cases have been filed under Obama. I found and read the indictments for each (they're easy to find, since FAS tracks them). They were: * Thomas Drake, an NSA employee who favored "ThinThread" instead of the later-adopted "Trailblazer" internet surveillance scheme, who then created a Hushmail account and fed classified do…

...But not Karl Rove

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plame_affair#Karl_Rove

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#47
post #3

This- to put it mildly- is Not Good. I'll quote David Carr's tweet[1],which best sums up my feelings on the matter: Lemme see, IRS going after political opponents plus DOJ tapping AP reporters. Nixonian optics on "the most transparent admin in history." I do wonder what kind of a legacy the Obama administration will leave to history when these kinds of events are stacked up. [1] https://twitter.com/carr2n/status/3340…

If you're making a list of the most tyrannical Presidents ever, you'd have to put FDR near the top of that. And his reputation has survived. Obama is a progressive. So are history professors. His legacy will be fine.

I'm not so sure. I think he's done some good work. But he's also on the precipice of having a whole generation of young idealists getting the shaft when it comes to the price of healthcare next year - if a new congressional report is to be believed.

Disclosure: this is my submission from earlier today on the topic: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5702248

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#48
post #46
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was an interesting argument, so I did some quick research. Apparently, six (6) Espionage Act cases have been filed under Obama. I found and read the indictments for each (they're easy to find, since FAS tracks them). They were: * Thomas Drake, an NSA employee who favored "ThinThread" instead of the later-adopted "Trailblazer" internet surveillance scheme, who then created a Hushmail account and fed classified do…

...But not Karl Rove http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plame_affair#Karl_Rove

Karl Rove was not a federal government employee when Obama assumed office.

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#49
post #29
post #13

Maybe my memory's failing me, but I can't think of a similarly-sized press surveillance operation by the Bush Administration. Keep in mind that under Obama, more alleged government leakers have been prosecuted than all of his predecessors combined: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-18/obama-pursuing-leak... This includes administrations that oversaw such problematic eras as the Cold War, the Vietnam War, the McCa…

This was an interesting argument, so I did some quick research. Apparently, six (6) Espionage Act cases have been filed under Obama. I found and read the indictments for each (they're easy to find, since FAS tracks them). They were: * Thomas Drake, an NSA employee who favored "ThinThread" instead of the later-adopted "Trailblazer" internet surveillance scheme, who then created a Hushmail account and fed classified do…

How do you feel about general whistleblowers like Peter Van Buren[1] and Gregory Hicks[2]? Neither have been prosecuted, but it's hard to deny they have been persecuted for their positions.

[1] http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/obama-whistleblo...

[2] http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57582929/official-we-kn...

Re: Government obtains wide AP phone records in probe

#50
post #49
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was an interesting argument, so I did some quick research. Apparently, six (6) Espionage Act cases have been filed under Obama. I found and read the indictments for each (they're easy to find, since FAS tracks them). They were: * Thomas Drake, an NSA employee who favored "ThinThread" instead of the later-adopted "Trailblazer" internet surveillance scheme, who then created a Hushmail account and fed classified do…

How do you feel about general whistleblowers like Peter Van Buren[1] and Gregory Hicks[2]? Neither have been prosecuted, but it's hard to deny they have been persecuted for their positions. [1] http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/obama-whistleblo... [2] http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57582929/official-we-kn...

I'm not clear on how Hicks claims to have been persecuted. Van Buren was fired after writing a tell-all book (which got him demoted to a work-from-home position) and maintaining a blog that linked to Wikileaks documents. I'm ambivalent about the prospect of being fired from a job for detracting from your government employer. On the one hand, you'd lose that same job at any private company where you did the same; on the other hand, in the public sector, detracting from your employer can be a public service. I guess I'd have to think about it on a case-by-case basis.
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