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Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

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Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#41
post #25

I just don't understand this attempts to use shitty and cheap piece of hardware to do development. You are not coding for food, right? Why bother yourself trying to use something that will make you so counterproductive? Need powerful something - get desktop. Need something slim and sexy - get f * macbookair Need both - get pro Need internet connection on the go - get nexus if you use tablet. Oh don't need it -use tet…

First thing you might be missing: there are probably a pile of folks on hacker news who don't have money. Students. People who have invested their life savings in their startup. People who work part time and see the world in the rest of their time. People who are spending their money on making sure their mum gets treatment for cancer. For these folks, getting the most out of the kit they can afford is important. And yes, thats a condescending statement aimed at you, but its not more condescending than "why don't you drop a couple grand on this problem?"

Second thing you might be missing: computers have marched forward in spec, yet most of us don't need tons of power in any dimension of the spec. My cheap chromebook ($200 or so) has 2G of ram. I went though uni with about of order of magnitude less ram, and was happy. The 16G ssd it ships with is sufficient for anything that isn't movies, music or photos. The ssd probably has more iops than 2005 era hard drives :). So the chromebook is low powered compared to the desktops of today, but its pretty powerful compared, to, for example, the computers google or facebook used to get off the ground.

Third thing: cloud compute. If I find myself needing thousands of hours of cpu time, I can get that on EC2 or similar. And its cheaper for everyone to rent cpu time when needed on a server in a well cooled warehouse somewhere where power is cheap, rather than have idle cpus connected up to city power grids.

I own a cheap chromebook (and I'm amused by you saying cheap in a negative way :)), and its fine for what it is. Its slim. Its not as sexy* as your mother, but hey. It has a debian chroot with all the normal tools on it. I don't worry about it being damaged or lost as much as I would if it was 5x as expensive. If I spent the money on a macbook air, I'd be buying a machine to run chrome and a terminal window, and all I'd be getting for my extra 800 dollars would be a nicer screen and track pad.

* I do wonder about people who describe computers as sexy.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#42
post #31

I'm so tempted to get one of these. With the shell plugin, I have access to my very high-powered servers, and Chrome comes with a nice development environment. Besides that, it's cheap and light -- a perfect roadkit. The only problem I see is the keyboard. I hate typing on netbook keyboards. I don't even like the keyboard on the Macbook Air. Maybe I'd get used to it after awhile?

I love the keyboard on my Chomebook however it's very similar to a Macbook Pro keyboard (which is similar to Macbook Air)

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#43
post #5

I don't see the point in using a crippled operating system when it will prevent you from quickly editing a low res screen cast or editing an image in the GIMP. Machines in that price range have enough performance to do some of these tasks even if they're not optimal for them. If I'm on the move away from a bigger system I might still need to do it though, so not having that capacity just because of someone's "in the…

I switched to a (non-developer-mode) Chromebook recently for work. It's a great development machine for what I use it for. My main workstation basically runs Chrome, Emacs, and some xterms. On my Pixel, I can just use Secure Shell to ssh to my tmux session and be working on exactly what I was using on my desktop. (Port forwarding works too, if you're developing a web app or something.) It's like being at my desktop e…

I've recently done the same thing, although coming from the perspective of "you can have my MacBook Air when you pry it from my cold dead hands". It turns out that when all of your development has to happen on your Linux desktop anyway, which laptop you use matters a whole lot less.

For people who live remotely, Chrome OS is perfectly serviceable. I think you have to already be in that remote mindset for it to be a comfortable switch, though.

The objections I usually see (including those in this thread) relate to what the laptop can't do locally, and a lot of those objections are perfectly legitimate. There's a lot these little boxes can't do easily with the tools available today (which again, isn't to say these things aren't possible, just that they're not there yet), and for people who need those things making such a switch isn't going to be possible.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#44
I say this on every Chromebook thread but I'll say it again because I see a lot of the same negativity as usual: the Samsung ARM Chromebook is f*cking awesome.

It's $250 so there's no argument about buying X or Y netbook instead, you can barely get anything with a keyboard that browses the internet for that price. Also for that price you get 2 (3?) years of 100GB on Google Drive and 12 Gogo WiFi passes, which together are already worth over $250. So you can throw the device in the trash and still come out on top. Now to the computer itself:

First, the battery life is awesome, 6.5 hours of solid use (WiFi model) and since it turns on from cold in ~7 seconds you can turn it off between sessions and not lose any power at all. If that's too long for you just close the lid, you'll lose about 1% per hour but everything resumes instantly when you open it (and I do mean INSTANTLY).

Second, the hardware is really excellent for the price. The keyboard is my favorite laptop keyboard out there (even against my MBP) and the trackpad is second only to Apple devices imo. It's the same weight/size as a MacBook Air but maybe 0.2" thicker. The only hardware downsides are the plastic chassis and the screen's somewhat bad viewing angles.

Third, it runs most of what you need right out of the box. I don't even have my in developer mode, you don't need that to use Google's Secure Shell and Remote Desktop Chrome extensions. It has an Offline version of Google Drive so you can keep your most important documents local and everything syncs when you're connected.

Fourth, it's stress-free. Because everything is synchronized to the cloud and the hardware is so cheap, you never have to worry about this thing. If it breaks (which it won't easily), just go to your nearest Best Buy, drop $250, and sign in with you Google account and you'll be back exactly where you left off (even down to the tabs you had open).

I really can't recommend this device more highly. It's definitely not the right device for full-time development but as a companion to a larger laptop or a desktop it's a perfect second machine and much more useful than an iPad or Transformer-style tablet (I've had both).

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#45
post #5

I don't see the point in using a crippled operating system when it will prevent you from quickly editing a low res screen cast or editing an image in the GIMP. Machines in that price range have enough performance to do some of these tasks even if they're not optimal for them. If I'm on the move away from a bigger system I might still need to do it though, so not having that capacity just because of someone's "in the…

I switched to a (non-developer-mode) Chromebook recently for work. It's a great development machine for what I use it for. My main workstation basically runs Chrome, Emacs, and some xterms. On my Pixel, I can just use Secure Shell to ssh to my tmux session and be working on exactly what I was using on my desktop. (Port forwarding works too, if you're developing a web app or something.) It's like being at my desktop e…

The only upside you seem to have there is the hardware itself, and that updating whichever OS (you don't specify) was harder before.

It's not like I don't have ssh here on my Ubuntu machine (similar model Thinkpad to yours), I don't see why you are trying to sell that as an upside. Indeed I have iPython in shell mode and a local copy of vim customized to my needs, and I have that as well as a server I can connect to at any time with all my sessions. Sometimes I might want to do an experiment locally rather than on a server though.

I can not only edit video (is anyone going to upload HD over the network to edit it on YouTube's editor?) , I can edit images, use my Wacom tablet, program things locally, I can record audio into Audacity and edit and change it. I can run LaTeX and actually work on academic documents. I can apt-get programs to resize many images, encode music or do just about anything. I can use R or python to generate graphs and save them locally rather than copy them from a server save or some crazy cloud save. On smaller data problems I can have a spreadsheet open for GUI editing in Libre Office and be saving to csv for a program to ingest after quick edits. Peripherals work without having to program an entirely new driver. It's a full desktop and it's fully featured, you can use it in a cloud-oriented way if you so choose as well so there doesn't seem to be any advantage to the Chromebooks other than this supposedly easier updating and nice sounding hardware.

The problem here is people are trying to sell an unfinished consumer OS as being good for developers or power users who already have powerfully polished desktop operating systems that are consumer oriented AND developer oriented as soon as you lift up the hood. In comparison the Chromebook simply doesn't stack up. The article was trying to push boot time as a feature for example, it just leads me to believe he hasn't installed Ubuntu in two years (or more actually).

I'm a power user so I need to work on images, video and audio, I need to be able to generate academic papers. I need to have OpenCV running locally on webcam feeds for testing things. I need advanced networking features from command line tools on localhost. It's all fine and dandy for them to come up with cut down device like a tablet with a keyboard, but after my experience of them turning off tethering on a Nexus device I am just not going to jump on board with anything until it's actually got more features and those features are actually not going to disappear at the whim of some advertising dollar driven decision. I don't think they'll ever be able to guarantee that properly. That OS sounds like it's years away from being remotely usable for a power user who's across a number of domains.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#46
post #29

Dropping down to dev mode to get access to ssh is overkill. I suggest https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/secure-shell/pnhec... which lets you run SSH as a normal Chrome extension.

You can just ssh via crosh without having to install anything extra. ssh in crosh does not require developer mode to be on.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#47
post #29

Dropping down to dev mode to get access to ssh is overkill. I suggest https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/secure-shell/pnhec... which lets you run SSH as a normal Chrome extension.

You can just ssh via crosh without having to install anything extra. ssh in crosh does not require developer mode to be on.

Also, last I checked, Secure Shell relies on an NaCl plugin incompatible with the Samsung ARM Chromebook.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As stated in the article, the "point" is to have the same functionality for a fraction of the cost. You can still run image editing software or whatever you'd run on your workstation using NX. That's somewhat inconvenient, but then it boots faster with no malware, and you are guaranteed nothing important is only stored locally. So it's a trade-off, not a "crippling" as you've put it. Some folks, like the author, bare…

Went to Best Buy, typed "laptop", first result Toshiba - Satellite 15.6" Laptop - 4GB Memory - 320GB Hard Drive - Satin Black Model: C855D/S5103 • SKU: 8119044 62 Ratings $279.99 That's 2x the ram and I get 320 HD which even if you don't want to use it for storage it's pretty awesome when running any OS that supports virtual memory. Have you looked at how much virtual memory your average Linux distro ends up using? T…

To be fair, that one is more than twice the weight of a chromebook (5.5 lbs vs 2.5).

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#49
post #25

I just don't understand this attempts to use shitty and cheap piece of hardware to do development. You are not coding for food, right? Why bother yourself trying to use something that will make you so counterproductive? Need powerful something - get desktop. Need something slim and sexy - get f * macbookair Need both - get pro Need internet connection on the go - get nexus if you use tablet. Oh don't need it -use tet…

My use-case is as a supplement to a heavier machine for travel. I love my 15" macbook pro, but I got tired of lugging it around Nepal, and I was always worried about it getting stolen or damaged.

I'd love to split my two computing needs: - 1 machine that's heavy and does everything. Maybe a desktop; maybe a 17" laptop that I only move between work and home. - 1 machine that's light, disposable, and does 90% of what I need to do. It fits in a traveller's backpack and I'm not heartbroken if it gets destroyed.

Right now I try to meet those needs somewhere in the middle with a medium-weight macbook pro, but it's definitely a compromise. I'd love to have both worlds.

Re: Chromebook can make a surprisingly sweet machine for a developer

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely curious, since I've used every nexus device to date: which ones disable tethering? I can't recall one that does.

Nexus 7 3G bought outright entirely separately to any plan or network carrier. Tethering is entirely disabled and many forums confirm this. And while I theoretically could I am not going to install a "cracked" version of Android from a l33td00d7 user on a php forum just to get a fundamentally basic and useful networking feature which is present in other installs of Android and which there was no reason to turn off. T…

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