Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

“The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

news.consumerreports.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 290 posts

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#61

Post by bhb916 »

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

There are a lot of reasons, as other commenters have pointed out, including all the existing capital that would have to be retooled or scraped.

However, I don't think you can overlook the damage the bailouts did. The Chrystler bailout in 1980 and the more recent GM bailout preserved the existing Detroit power structure. All of that talented labor pool and capital that would have been set free via liquidation instead was allowed to stay together. These companies didn't innovate because they didn't have to.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#62

Post by michaelhoffman »

newbie12 wrote: post #44

Consumer Reports is part of Ralph Nader's Consumer Union, an extremely left-wing operation. It is inconceivable that a $89k car with a top range of just 200 miles gets their top rating without a bias.

Consumers Union was founded in 1936, when Ralph Nader was not yet two years old. Ralph Nader was on the board for a while but resigned in 1975 because it focused on product testing rather than advocacy.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9A07E6DC1F3C...

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#63

Post by kunai »

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

> Why can't the existing industry do this

They are, but at a snail's pace. The Mercedes SLS Electric Drive came out a few months ago, I believe, and it's a work of engineering and art.

But Ford isn't Mercedes, and they can't afford to switch up their assembly processes because then it would drive up the prices of the cars they sell, which defeats the point of Ford -- affordable, reliable transportation. Remove the affordable, because the cost of manufacture goes up immensely, and the reliability goes down. Electric automobiles are still experimental technology, albeit very mature experimental technology. Imagine them as Debian testing installs that are very stable, but still aren't as stable as Debian stable installs (the gasoline-powered vehicles).

It will take time, but it will also take game-changers like Tesla for electric cars to go mainstream.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#65

Post by manmal »

fein wrote: post #30
technoslut wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After test driving a Tesla, I agree with much of what you said and one is the engine noise. I prefer sports cars and especially the sound of a V8/12. To me it's better than listening to music. I do understand that those purchasing a luxury vehicle have different expectations. Those in sedans appreciate cabin silence more than others.

I personally believe that the importance lies in awareness more than anything else. I generally don't run the radio in my car (even though its a piddly 1.8t GTI) because listening to the engine is important. There are all sorts of audible clues to the state of your car that get completely drowned out with the radio blaring. I have a feeling that this is part of the source of some of the ridiculous "I've been driving…

My dad (working in automative industry) told me that tire pressure sensors were invented solely for the US market, because people in every other nation manage to check their tires every once in a while, while Americans drive until their tires "implode".

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#66

Post by lanstein »

beachstartup wrote: post #20
acchow wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To me it's better than listening to music. I humbly submit that you haven't listened to the right music.

I humbly submit that you haven't been driving the right cars.

There has to be a market for a company to add a V12 sound to the Tesla S.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#67

Post by dm2 »

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

A small part of it is right place at the right time. (California, 21st century, oligopoly in auto industry, government loans)

Part of it is being a well-known billionaire and engineer who partners with the right people to get the job done.

Part of it was determination and long-nights in the office.

Part of it was being able to avoid the red-tape (and stakeholder interests) that the market leaders have in their companies.

Tesla, SpaceX and SolarCity would make good case studies about how to take a finite (but large) amount of capital and develop it into companies that can change the world.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#68

Post by narrator »

spodek wrote: post #7

I have learned cynicism and skepticism about a lot of media, but Consumer Reports remains one of the few sources -- the only one I can think of offhand -- that I trust without a second thought. I like their business plan and focus on doing what they do well. Their reviews mean something (even to someone like me who lives in Manhattan and doesn't drive).

Because too much money makes a company stupid. Look at Paul Graham's essay about what went wrong at Yahoo ( http://www.paulgraham.com/yahoo.html). Same thing happened at GM, too much money for too long turned the culture from creating the future to protecting sacred cows.

What's worse is these big stagnant companies often have access to very large pools of money from the public markets to buy up scrappy competitors and sap their innovativeness.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#69

Post by jfb »

bane wrote: post #53
TWAndrews wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saturn was an attempt to do something similar--though less ambitious. It worked for awhile, but ended up subsumed by GM.

The Saturn started really strong IIR, but by the end the product just wasn't there.

Saturn died because of GM/UAW internal politics.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#70

Post by orangethirty »

acchow wrote: post #16
technoslut wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After test driving a Tesla, I agree with much of what you said and one is the engine noise. I prefer sports cars and especially the sound of a V8/12. To me it's better than listening to music. I do understand that those purchasing a luxury vehicle have different expectations. Those in sedans appreciate cabin silence more than others.

> To me it's better than listening to music. I humbly submit that you haven't listened to the right music.

Music hath nothing over Ferrari V12 engines.

May I present the sounds of a Ferrari Formula 1 V12 from 1994. Turn up your speakers. Get a hair brush ready. All of your body hair will stand up as the wonderful sound of God's engine crawls up under your skin and makes your essence tingle in pleasure. You might want to smoke a cigarette afterwards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBXUOomynxw

Post reply on HN