“The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car” • Hacker News Board

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#31

Post by codeulike » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:35 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

Because being excellent doesn't come easy? Elon Musk is not just 'some guy' - At Tesla he's "Head of Product Design", not just some businessman who hired a few engineers.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#32

Post by rayiner » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:36 PM UTC

Shivetya wrote: post #4

No offense, at these price points the car better damn well be perfect. When they deliver a car at an every man's price point and score very high then I will be impressed. A year to two down the road and maintain that level of performance I will be impressed. Until then, cars are these price points have large enough margins that extra time and detail can be baked into the process. Kudos for beating the other luxury gu…

The Model S is a full-size high performance luxury sedan, and very price-competitive at ~$100k decked out. It's competitors aren't the Honda accords of the world, but these: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/1301_2013_bmw_m5_.... The BMW M5 is comparably priced at just over $100k "as tested" and the Porsche Panamera GTS is around $150k. None of these are "perfect" cars.

The Model S goes toe-to-toe with those cars that get 14-20 miles per gallon. It's quarter mile time is right between the M5 and the Panamera.

Maybe it's stupid, but measures of how quickly you can haul 4,500+ pounds of luxury car from 0-60 are the coin of the realm in this segment, and the Model S is enormously impressive in this regard. It's a brilliant play by Tesla, actually, competing with high-margin cars that can justify high-budget R&D before working down the line.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#33

Post by TWAndrews » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:36 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

Saturn was an attempt to do something similar--though less ambitious. It worked for awhile, but ended up subsumed by GM.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#34

Post by sinnerswing » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:37 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

Execution is hard. Remember Fisker?

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#35

Post by codeulike » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:37 PM UTC

kgmpers wrote: post #24

I don't know where to ask this, but does anyone know why they bothered with the front trunk? Was it just to keep the Model S looking like a typical car, so people would be less averse to considering it? Crumple zone for accidents? Seems like it would be unnecessary weight on a car where that would effect range.

Looks to me like they've gone out of their way to make it look similar-but-slightly-different to other cars. I'm sure they did their market research. People expect cars to look a certain way.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#36

Post by gtCameron » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:37 PM UTC

acchow wrote: post #16

technoslut wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After test driving a Tesla, I agree with much of what you said and one is the engine noise. I prefer sports cars and especially the sound of a V8/12. To me it's better than listening to music. I do understand that those purchasing a luxury vehicle have different expectations. Those in sedans appreciate cabin silence more than others.

> To me it's better than listening to music. I humbly submit that you haven't listened to the right music.

I don't care how good the music is at the time, I still turn it off and roll down the windows every time I drive my M5 through a tunnel.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#37

Post by pbreit » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:39 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

It's pretty dumb that upstarts have such large advantages against incumbents merely because incumbents choose not to disrupt their legacies.

You see the same thing in airlines. You'd think there'd be little harder than starting an airline and yet southwest, JetBlue and virgin come in and have great success.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#38

Post by samolang » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:40 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

First, he has a degree in physics. He didn't just read a few books, he's a very smart guy.

Second, Tesla suffered quarterly losses for their first 10 years of its existence. It wasn't "that easy". It was a long struggle.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#39

Post by jfb » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:40 PM UTC

moconnor wrote: post #18

bane wrote: post #8

There's something that's been bothering me about this whole thing. Not the Tesla, but the rest of the market. Is that it? Is it that easy? A guy who made his money selling a phonebook and then an online payment processor can read a few books, hire a few people out of the same industry he's disrupting and build a goddamn amazing car (electric or not)? Why can't the existing industry do this? Why all the mediocre produ…

The classic "Innovator's Dilemma" attempts to address this - the idea here would be that electric cars are disruptive technology, one which otherwise good management practices more or less prevent market encumbents successfully exploiting. Read the book, I highly recommend it if you're interested by these kinds of questions!

But electric cars aren't a disruptive technology. The only thing that might qualify as disruptive about Tesla is their direct to customer sales model, and I have a hard time seeing how they'll get around the entrenched interests there.

The Model S is by all accounts an excellent car, and I want one, but I am bearish on Tesla the company.

Re: “The Tesla Model S is our top-scoring car”

#40

Post by mhb » Thu, May 09, 2013, 4:41 PM UTC

spodek wrote: post #7

I have learned cynicism and skepticism about a lot of media, but Consumer Reports remains one of the few sources -- the only one I can think of offhand -- that I trust without a second thought. I like their business plan and focus on doing what they do well. Their reviews mean something (even to someone like me who lives in Manhattan and doesn't drive).

Yes, they do reviews well. But a lot of their consumer advocacy would profit from better (or any?) cost/benefit analysis.