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Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

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Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#91

Post by nathan_long »

jeffdavis wrote: post #59
spwestwood wrote: post #20

SuperFreakonomics attributed the dramatic drop in crime in the 1990s to Roe vs Wade. http://www.freakonomics.com/2005/05/15/abortion-and-crime-wh...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Impact_of_Legalized_Abortio... A number of people disagree with that conclusion based on seemingly reasonable scientific arguments.

Furthermore, if it's meant to be an argument for abortion, it really has no effect on the pro-life position.

If you start with the understanding that a baby in the womb is a human, this arguments sounds like "it's good that we have legal murder because it prevents illegal murder".

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#92

Post by learc83 »

edtechdev wrote: post #80

Well back in 1993, almost 49% of households had a gun. Today the number is 32%. That alone is a 35% drop in gun ownership. There are so many other factors that could play a role here. And none of them negate the need for common sense gun regulations and re-funding research on both gun and non-gun violence.

Household says nothing about the number of guns or the gun availability. Your granddad's rusty shotgun sitting your closet counts as the entire household "owning" a gun.

The average household size is smaller today than it was in 1993, meaning that it's possible that more individuals actually own guns.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#93

Post by longone »

greedo wrote: post #73
longone wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if politicians are in on this, bit of a conspiracy that I don't want to get into. However, crime and murder sell. My mother loves to watch the 10 O'Clock news every night but luckily she reads the paper and surfs the web, otherwise I think she might lose her mind. Those nightly news programs are awful. If I only watched local or even cable news and used them as my source for staying in touch with the wor…

Many would be better off not watching any news or reading any newspapers. Even relying on the Internet makes things tough since there's a firehose of data, and this leads to confirmation bias having a huge affect.

Yes, I agree with that. Although I have to say that I think reading the news is far better than ever watching it. When you read it you can take your time with it and selectively choose what articles you want to read rather than having a bunch of crap thrown at you at a high pace.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#94

Post by dclowd9901 »

platz wrote: post #55

Just a sanity check: "Researchers have studied the decline in firearm crime and violent crime for many years, and though there are theories to explain the decline, there is no consensus among those who study the issue as to why it happened."

If I had to guess, I'd say it's because it's harder to get away with a gun crime now than it used to be. TV shows like CSI probably have more to do with the decline in gun violence than any other environmental factors.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#95

Post by jordan0day »

dmix wrote: post #23
jstalin wrote: post #8

The drop is all the more remarkable considering that there are at least 168,000,000 more guns in circulation in the US now than when gun homicide peaked in 1993.[1] [1]: https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/1998_2013_sta...

To keep the numbers relative, US Population: 1993: 257,746,103 2012: 315,809,000 = 58,062,897 more people since 1993. So 2.8x as many guns than population increase.

Maybe it's an economic indicator? Collecting guns is a popular hobby, so perhaps a rise in gun sales correlates to a rise in the economic standing of gun collectors?

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#96

Post by learc83 »

granitepail wrote: post #62
corresation wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

750 were killed by hammers or clubs which includes any blunt force attack (vase, bat, golf club, etc. I am assuming that you're accurately quoting a number, though last I saw that number was more in the 450 range). Secondly every home has numerous objects that qualify as "clubs", many of them serving valid, functional roles (for instance to hammer, or to hit balls, etc). In many households a firearm has one single pu…

It's also worth noting that while blunt objects such as hammers and baseball bats find uses in construction and non-violent sports, guns do not necessarily share such innocent use cases. Sport shooting is the major exemption (I'm quite a fan, myself) but at the end of the day guns are designed to put holes (some messier than others) in objects very far away. When a gun is pointed at a living organism and the trigger…

> When a gun is pointed at a living organism and the trigger is pulled, its chances of survival plummet.

When a hammer is raised above someone's head and lowered with force, chances of survival plummet.

Guns are a far more useful tool than baseball bats. Guns have a non recreational purposes as functional tools, baseball bats do not.

The number of deaths per baseball bat are far higher than the number of deaths per "assault weapon", making baseball bats deadlier by far.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#97

Post by nemof »

learc83 wrote: post #54
corresation wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

750 were killed by hammers or clubs which includes any blunt force attack (vase, bat, golf club, etc. I am assuming that you're accurately quoting a number, though last I saw that number was more in the 450 range). Secondly every home has numerous objects that qualify as "clubs", many of them serving valid, functional roles (for instance to hammer, or to hit balls, etc). In many households a firearm has one single pu…

>The second is that few argue for "rifle control", but instead want "gun control". Except that's not what was actually happening. Most of what was hotly debated over the last few months has been over an "Assault Weapons Ban", that is a ban on certain semi-automatic rifles, very rarely involved in crime. It was only after that was defeated that people started talking about universal background checks. >Those guns that…

Yes there is http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/03/suicides-vs-handgun-...

Introduce background checks and you will reduce the number of suicides, more likely than not.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#98

Post by corresation »

jordan0day wrote: post #90
corresation wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

750 were killed by hammers or clubs which includes any blunt force attack (vase, bat, golf club, etc. I am assuming that you're accurately quoting a number, though last I saw that number was more in the 450 range). Secondly every home has numerous objects that qualify as "clubs", many of them serving valid, functional roles (for instance to hammer, or to hit balls, etc). In many households a firearm has one single pu…

Do you have a source for that 30,000+ figure? The FBI statistics link in this thread mentions around 8600 firearm-related murders for 2011 (but not suicide or accidents). That's the only hard data I've seen in this thread so far though. In these sorts of threads, anecdotes and hyperbole can quickly overrule data and thoughtfulness, so I'm just hoping that numbers like "30,000+" aren't being pulled out of thin air. I'…

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-19/american-gun-deaths...

As others have mentioned, a hefty percentage of those deaths are suicides. Would those suicides have happened if the option of a firearm wasn't available? Perhaps.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#99

Post by ownagefool »

corresation wrote: post #30
Terretta wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> selectively choose which crime stats to promote For example, FBI homicide stats last year show 350 killed by rifles of any kind, assault or otherwise, while 750 killed by hammers. I keep waiting for the groundswell of public support for hammer control.

750 were killed by hammers or clubs which includes any blunt force attack (vase, bat, golf club, etc. I am assuming that you're accurately quoting a number, though last I saw that number was more in the 450 range). Secondly every home has numerous objects that qualify as "clubs", many of them serving valid, functional roles (for instance to hammer, or to hit balls, etc). In many households a firearm has one single pu…

I have a baseball bat in my house and it's not there to hit balls but to hit anyone who attempts to come into my home without my permission. I doubt I'll ever need to use it, but there you go, it's one single purpose is to "maim or kill", which in reality is actually protection and I'd be happy with fear itself being the deciding factor.

I don't come down on either side on gun control, they're mostly banned here in the UK and that's just how it is. However, I think you'll find most people actually consider protection is a legitimate reason to have a weapon, so you shouldn't so easily write it off.

Re: Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

#100

Post by rgraham »

bluedino wrote: post #67
shawabawa3 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deaths by handguns in US 2011: 6,220 [1] Most people aren't really bothered by rifles (which are mostly used for hunting), but handguns (which really have no purpose except killing humans) [1] http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/c...

Rifles (especially AK47s) are very popular with gangs for drive by shootings.

Do you have a citation for that? AK47s became popular with many hunters and target shooters because they're rugged, cheap, and have really cheap ammunition for target practice with a rifle.
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