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You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

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Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#51

Post by jeremyjh »

nostrademons wrote: post #25

Wow. I don't feel guilty for over-sleeping. I've worked out a life for myself where people don't care that I sleep until 11:00. I simply don't schedule meetings or appointments for the morning, or if there's absolutely one that can't be avoided, I go to bed early and set an alarm clock to wake up for it. It is not being a sissy to know your limitations and preferences and to work around them. If you make a commitment…

I doubt he'd have a problem with you. His issue seems pretty clearly to be with people who do not keep their commitments. If you don't start your day before 11 then obviously don't accept meeting invites before that time and you are golden. Oh wait, you work at a company where 9:00 meetings are normative? I guess that job is a commitment too, isn't it?

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#52

Post by ajross »

jaggederest wrote: post #11

Light therapy. Or, you know, modafinil works too. The answer isn't always 'man up', neither is it 'I am a victim'. Just treat it and move on with your life. You're not a hero for getting to work on time, but neither are you a villain for being late.

The world is a big place and everyone has their own circumstance. But I think the point of the Great Big Get-Off-My-Lawn Rant (which I loved) was more that for the vast majority of people in the vast majority of circumstances getting up in the morning doesn't rise to the level of a severe personal handicap.

I mean, I hate mornings as much as the next person, and have slept through a decent number of events. Yet still, when I had kids and had to get up for a crying baby or to change a diaper, I Just Did It, and didn't feel the need to blog about whether I should feel "guilty" about it.

I mean, really: don't we have more important things to argue about? Isn't there a new Javascript rendering abstraction layer or something?

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#53

Post by sp332 »

alexjeffrey wrote: post #29
sp332 wrote: post #3

It’s your fault and your fault alone. If you're in a coma, is that your fault? If you have narcolepsy, is it your fault? If you wake up having hit a snooze button that you didn't consciously push , is that your fault? If you have a medical condition that makes it harder for you to wake up than for 99.8% of the population, is that your fault? There's a line somewhere, and I don't think the author of the original artic…

I think the point here is that everything today is considered a "medical condition". While that makes sense from a medical perspective, all it does is give people excuses for not dealing with their problems. "I can't get to work on time, I have Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome". "I can't focus in class, I have Attention Deficit Disorder". These are genuine difficulties that afflicted people will have to face, but don't a…

all it does is give people excuses for not dealing with their problems.

Even the original article didn't do that. The author lists several steps he took to improve his condition. He just wanted people to avoid useless guilt, he didn't give them a free pass.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#54

Post by russelluresti »

I'm not sure you got the point of the article. You seem to be a "blind rage" mood today so I'll try to make it a little clearer.

He's not saying "it's not your fault." He's saying you have a real medical condition that needs to be treated. He also points out how to treat it and manage the condition, so that people will not continue to have their oversleeping issues.

What you're saying in response amounts to telling a person with depression that they're a buzz kill and should just cheer up.

People need to understand that chemicals play a huge part of how our body functions, and that not everyone has the same chemistry going on in their bodies. These chemical abnormalities can have a huge impact on your life and show up under a wide range of different conditions - depression, anxiety, bi-polar, ADHD, etc. These are real conditions caused by real physical things and, just because you can't see them as obviously as a broken arm, doesn't mean they're not real.

Your ignorance and lack of understanding isn't a virtue. It's not something to be proud of. Educate yourself.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#55

Post by _delirium »

eridius wrote: post #19

The author of this post comes across as a raging jackass. I'd never heard of Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome until I read the other post, but it perfectly describes my life. I've never really known how to describe just how difficult it is to get up in the morning, but it is really, truly difficult. Joe Conway, you said in your post that "every single one of your actions is controllable". If you truly believe this, you s…

Don't feed the troll.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#56

Post by tmorton »

This post and the original post set up a massive false dichotomy. Yes, keep your commitments. Yes, pull your weight at work. For many people, that means getting your ass into the office at a normal time.

But in order to get there, you should understand yourself and work with who you are. If a label like "delayed sleep phase syndrome" helps you manage your life, use it. Either set good expectations with your team, or set up systems to help you out.

The ass-kicking rhetoric of this post is true, as far as it goes. For some people, this sort of wake-up call is exactly what they need. But for many people, "just do it" is not a useful message. Feeling guilty is useful if it kicks you into action - but too much and it just holds you down, preventing you from making progress.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#57

Post by michaelochurch »

kryptiskt wrote: post #35

The saddest thing is how morning persons have managed to make a virtue out of their biological clock and that their preferences are so deeply ingrained in society now.

It's also an age thing. As you get older, your sleep moves in the early direction and you also need less of it (if you're in good health). My dad's 61 and sleeps 9-to-3:30. I seem to be headed in that direction. I'm usually up by 6-7 even if I go to bed at 2:30, so the smart thing for me to do is sleep earlier.

It's biology. Giving it a moral weight is nonsense.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#58

Post by jaggederest »

anonymoushn wrote: post #24
jaggederest wrote: post #11

Light therapy. Or, you know, modafinil works too. The answer isn't always 'man up', neither is it 'I am a victim'. Just treat it and move on with your life. You're not a hero for getting to work on time, but neither are you a villain for being late.

Modafinil is not a long-term solution as regular use causes tolerance.

As someone who has used it for this exact purpose, it's enough to use it occasionally to enable you to keep your sleep schedule in check. If I don't manage my sleep schedule well, I end up waking up later and later, and having to loop over. Modafinil perhaps once a month allowed me to reset without having to burn a couple days being useless.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#59

Post by baddox »

kryptiskt wrote: post #35

The saddest thing is how morning persons have managed to make a virtue out of their biological clock and that their preferences are so deeply ingrained in society now.

The influence of agriculture is still strong, understandably.

Re: You should feel guilty for over-sleeping; or, my generation is full of sissies.

#60

Post by xradionut »

Grow up on a farm. Do a stint in the military. Go to college while working two part time jobs. Experience crazy shifts in semiconductor fab. Work for startups. Get lots of responsibility. Now wonder why kids can't show up on time. Get off my lawn!

:)

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