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World's first 3D printed gun test fired

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Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#51
post #45
post #43

The only reason for wanting to read this is in hope that it alerts everyone about how flawed US gun regulations are and home much there is to do. Also, if this "manufacturing" was to be regulated, it would be great to know that gun manufacturer's representative, the NRA, will no longer be needed, if in fact "freedom" is that its members want.

The NRA is the gunowners' representative. The National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Shooting_Sports_Founda... ) is the "national trade association for the firearms industry..., the organization has more than 7,000 members: firearms manufacturers, distributors, retailers, shooting ranges, sportsmen's clubs and media." Whereas individual gun owners, 5 million, a million more th…

The NRA's leadership is dominated by industry: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/01/new-evid...

The sole purpose of the NRA is to protect corporate profit: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-weisser/open-letter-to-wa...

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#52
post #36
post #27

You can't 3D print the bullets. Thus I'd speculate that this development does not significantly impact the effectiveness of gun control laws nor does it accomplish the goals of the creator.

Bullets aren't really controlled. You can buy them online or at Walmart, legally.

Not true. Bullets are really controlled.

Varies from state to state and even county to county. In NYC and many other places, if you're caught with bullets for a gun you aren't permitted to possess, you can be charged with felony possession of ammunition. This is particularly used against those with prior arrests and/or convictions on their record.

But, you know... I am not a lawyer.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#53
post #42
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullets aren't really controlled. You can buy them online or at Walmart, legally.

For starters, there is no Walmart here, nor is ammunition legally obtainable as far as I know.

Which country are you in? I wasn't aware that any non-authoritarian countries had complete bans on all types of ammunition.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#54
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NRA is the gunowners' representative. The National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Shooting_Sports_Founda... ) is the "national trade association for the firearms industry..., the organization has more than 7,000 members: firearms manufacturers, distributors, retailers, shooting ranges, sportsmen's clubs and media." Whereas individual gun owners, 5 million, a million more th…

The NRA's leadership is dominated by industry: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/01/new-evid... The sole purpose of the NRA is to protect corporate profit: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-weisser/open-letter-to-wa...

Why do you find it difficult to believe the two are in near perfect alignment?

OK, it was a bit complicated when there were large stocks of military surplus still to be liquidated, the NRA supported both the GCA of '68 but also the later relaxation of imports of military surplus. On the other hand, do you really think the members of the NRA find it damning that one of the Nominating Committee members is "a timber company executive in Alabama" like Mother Jones does??? You think we're a hot bed of hatred towards free enterprise?

Very curious that the NRA put George Kollitides on the Nominating Committee because of his history, but it's hardly out of whack to have one manufacturer and one dealer member each; in fact, that sounds about right.

Your claim that it having 2 out of 9 members from the industry means they "dominate" the NRA leadership does not stand up to examination. Heck, even the Atlantic article you cite says "the corporate-front theory is still probably too simplistic" and "It's very hard to disentagle the interests of the gun industry from the views of gun rights purists."

Indeed: no gun or ammo manufactures rather obviously means no guns and ammo for us to shoot. We've very interested in their health, we're in the same boat, attack them, you attack us. And the NSSF does quite a bit for gun owners in a whole range of areas including the political, although their focus is of course on the industry.

As for "sole purpose", I didn't bother to read the cited article, but do you mean the NRA's gun safety efforts, largely credited with decreasing the absolute number of fatal gun accidents by 1/4 at the same time the population and number of guns owned has increased by 1/2, was solely done to protect "corporate profit"? Sorry, I'm not that cynical.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#56
post #16

I always wonder why these articles don't mention that the ability to personally make a gun with a CNC machine has existed for quite a few years. There isn't a lot of new ground being broken in terms of "Freedom to create firearms in your home" with 3D printing.

I think it's a big story. 3d printing opens many possibilities that CNC doesn't offer. A CNC requires specialised skill. Downloading and printing 3d doesn't. Building guns with a CNC requires a lot of labour. Whereas you can imagine having a lab full of 3d printers being operated by a single pensioner. 3d printers look like they'll be generic and mass-produced. If so, in ten years there will be 3d printers everywhere…

Indeed. When the 3d printed AR-15 receiver was making news, I did some research and found that people had been carving them out of wood blocks for years and years. This is nothing so new.

The newness comes from being able to have an unskilled user setup a 3d printer, buy some ABS plastic to feed into it, download a file from the internet and begin producing guns. I don't know if this is a good or bad thing, but it's something to watch carefully.

I could imagine a future where it's almost like the wild west again, so many people who would harm you have guns that everyone carries one in a holster, and it's just considered normal, like wearing a sword all the time was normal for the samurai. This may end up being a likely future in the USA since the 2nd amendment is impossible to repeal.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#57
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now if you can 3d-print a reliable rifle like an AK-47, that could get interesting. The team that made this gun are already doing the most difficult bit from the AR-15, a semi-automatic rifle that has been used in several massacres in the west (including the one that sparked heavy gun regulation in Australia in the 90s). That's why I thought this was news. First they made the lower-receiver of a powerful gun. Now the…

the most difficult bit from the AR-15 As far as I understand it, the lower receiver on an AR-15 is actually a pretty trivial housing component, subject to almost no operational pressures, but interesting legally because it's where the gun's serial number happens to be stamped. (But I should note I don't really know much about AR-15s, just stuff I've read.)

Correct: the gas block, barrel, breech, etc., are all "upper" bits and take most of the physical stress. The lower includes the trigger assembly and magazine holder thingy, which are the serialized, "this is a gun" parts. Conceivably one could 3D-print the lower receiver, order the upper assembly, rotating bolt, recoil buffer, etc., through the mail with a prepaid card, and have an essentially untraceable rifle.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#58
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NRA's leadership is dominated by industry: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/01/new-evid... The sole purpose of the NRA is to protect corporate profit: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-weisser/open-letter-to-wa...

Why do you find it difficult to believe the two are in near perfect alignment? OK, it was a bit complicated when there were large stocks of military surplus still to be liquidated, the NRA supported both the GCA of '68 but also the later relaxation of imports of military surplus. On the other hand, do you really think the members of the NRA find it damning that one of the Nominating Committee members is "a timber com…

The gun industry sells an image of masculinity and rugged individualism. The NRA is part of this image, and arguably is the greatest public relations strategy in the history of Western consumerism.

Unlike say blue jeans commercials where manly men hang out on their pickup trucks which most people realize is purely for marketing, people really think the NRA and associated marketing is real.

All the purchase of a firearm represents is a very slight decrease in the probability that you and the civilians around you will survive tomorrow. Widespread availability of firearms also enables and promotes the terrorism we regularly see carried out in the US, but of course the probability of being personally victimized by terrorism is exceedingly low.

So no, gun owners and gun industry interests are not "aligned". Gun industry makes enormous profit on the sale of its image. Gun owners get the benefit of believing they are rugged individuals protecting liberty, at the cost of a couple hundred/thousand bucks and living in a modestly more dangerous society.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#59
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullets aren't really controlled. You can buy them online or at Walmart, legally.

Not true. Bullets are really controlled. Varies from state to state and even county to county. In NYC and many other places, if you're caught with bullets for a gun you aren't permitted to possess, you can be charged with felony possession of ammunition. This is particularly used against those with prior arrests and/or convictions on their record. But, you know... I am not a lawyer.

This is only true for a few states, I'm not aware of even some of the worst like Massachusetts doing the same (e.g. there getting expended .22 LR brass stuck in the sole of your sandal is a crime punished by a mandatory one year in jail). As I recall, NY state, forget the city, makes it illegal for your spouse to use one of your handguns.

Most states, assume 40+, and most of the population, say, 2/3rds+, don't live under such insane restrictions. Looking at the top states by population, California is #1, in the middle of the 8 worst for gun owners, and I'm pretty sure doesn't do this. Don't remember Illinois doing it either. New Jersey, maybe.

To finish, the Feds allow ammo by mail order, the only restriction is the usual "Stick an ORD-M label on the package" and ship by ground. That's about as unregulated as you can get except for the usual age limit.

Re: World's first 3D printed gun test fired

#60
post #27

You can't 3D print the bullets. Thus I'd speculate that this development does not significantly impact the effectiveness of gun control laws nor does it accomplish the goals of the creator.

One thing that wasn't mentioned in the article is that he had to embed a metal block into the plastic so that the gun was detectable on an x-ray machine. This was to comply with the Undetectable Firearms Act of 1988.

Could someone who had a printer and the downloaded file skip that part? Yes. But they could possibly be fined and jailed for up to 5 years.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/STATUTE-102/pdf/STATUTE-102-Pg3...

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